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| Latest Threads |
Repetition of words
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The Book Switch Theory
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My pet theory
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Trying to identify the in...
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Huth's reading of f116v: ...
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Scoring artefact for 45% ...
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No text, but a visual cod...
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Water, earth and air
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The claimed Voynich page
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Voynich Zoom CFP
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| The quest for Anchiton |
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Posted by: Anton - 22-10-2018, 04:46 PM - Forum: Provenance & history
- Replies (79)
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This is a branch from the You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. thread, just to make the latter more lightweight, since it's apparently overloaded with different subjects by now.
This one is about "anchiton". Below is the quick summary for the start of this new thread, why anchiton is important.
The second line of You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. marginalia, after a cross, begins with a word, one of the readings of which is "anchiton". There have been other readings as well, such as "michiton", "nichiton", "michi con" and others - those could be consulted in the You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. thread. This new thread presupposes that the reading is "anchiton" and leads a branch of investigation in the light of that hypothesis.
The question is immediately there what this "anchiton" might be, and how it might relate to the no less mysterious "oladabas", and some other tentative readings in the line such as "carcere" or "portas". If "anchiton" is found elsewhere - and the more so, in the context of some "portas" and so on (most preferably with "oladabas"!) then we could draw conclusions not only about the meaning of the respective piece of marginalia, but, more broadly, about the cultural context of the creation of the VMS (since it is quite probable that these marginalia were put down by one of the VMS scribes).
Unfortunately, for a long period of time, noone could suggest what is "anchiton" (if anything), let alone throw any sufficient light upon "oladabas". For now, it is sufficient to say that "oladabas" is still in the dark, but there has been some progress with "anchiton" in the recent years.
First of all, Searcher found the mention of "anchiton" in comments to the Bible by Nicolas de Lyra, as printed in You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. in 1549. This Lyra was a Frenchman living in XIII - XIV centuries, and he was a great authority upon the Bible, with his comments widely referred to in the Western world for centuries to come.
In fact, the messy layout of the book makes it difficult to decide whether the comment of interest is by de Lyra or from Glossa Ordinaria, but anyway its comment to Exodus 27 runs as this:
Quote:Nec mirum hoc de sanctuario et interioribus templi et altaris et thymiamatis credere, cuius etiam anchiton ligni genus vel ligno simile, quanto plus arserit tanto mundius inveniatur.
A translation would be welcome, but with the help of Google I understand that this refers to "anchiton" as a kind of wood that cannot be destroyed by fire, only emerges from fire cleaner than it was.
Exodus 27:1 in itself is about making the altar of the "shittim" wood:
Quote:And thou shalt make an altar of shittim wood...
As VViews pointed out, the "thymiamatis" of the biblical comment and the "shittim" (or "setim") of the Bible are the same thing, something of Acacia species. The point being that this wood is resistant to fire (which makes it a natural material to make an altar of). It remains unclear though, why thymiamatis is called "anchiton" or is compared to some "anchiton" (not sure which of the two, my Latin is not sufficient) here.
I'll continue my post shortly, meanwhile I'm locking the thread so as not to mess it with the future discussion.
Thx for your patience 
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| [Essentials] Theory and Practice - questions of method. |
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Posted by: Diane - 20-10-2018, 06:54 AM - Forum: Voynich Talk
- Replies (7)
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It is usual to find, in any formal study, a keen discussion of methodology and principles. HOW does one go about investigating an idea's validity? What sort of factual basis is required to justify the formation of a 'theory' and what is the difference between a passing notion, an 'idea', a self-referential fiction and so on.
We see none of that sort of discussion in the study today - and as a rule any effort to raise questions about methodology or current practice sees a ton-weight of censure-bricks descend on one's head, because it is impossible to discuss where we've gone wrong, or where we are going well, without footnotes and accurately-attributed examples.
Anyway, on the theme of absent, flawed, careless or long-outmoded methods in creating theories about history and the transmission of objects and ideas, I recently mentioned 'Entanglements' and their schematic representation.
Since there are now quite a number of other Voynich authors who have followed the pioneers into the area of eastern Greek culture, medieval Constantinople and the wider Byzantine sphere, and some who argue that the manuscript passed from this or that region to another at thus-and-thus a time in history, may I introduce you to the style of Entanglement diagrams in that context.
The following paper is available through Research Gate and contains a large number of illustrative graphs and diagrams as well as impeccably researched text. Fully footnoted and with earlier observations and conclusions CORRECTLY attributed to their sources, allowing you to test the value of those sources, as well as testing the later author's integrity. This sort of testing is a routine part of academic method and it would be odd indeed if scholars were censured for such method - or indeed for criticism of others' methodology.
See,
Johannes Preiser-Kapeller, 'Calculating the Synod? New Quantitative and Qualitative Approaches for the Analysis of the Patriarchate and the Synod of Constantinople in the 14thC', Paper presented at the 22nd International Congress of Byzantine Studies: Proceedings of the Round Table "Le Patriarcat Oecuménique de Constantinople et Byzance « hors frontières »" published January 2014.
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| Frogs, toads and magic |
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Posted by: Diane - 20-10-2018, 03:18 AM - Forum: Imagery
- Replies (2)
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Moderators are welcome to shift this thread to another part of the forum. I'm not sure where it should go.
Kunisada Utagawa Kuniyoshi has recently begun a series of blog-posts about toads, frogs and magic in Eastern Asia - mainly Japan.
I mention it to show two things
1. Why I do not think the Voynich botanical pictures or 'leaf and root' sections done by, or from, Japanese sources
and
2. Why a number of iconographic elements in the Vms are demonstrably inherited from the more generally Asian traditions in art.
The linked blogpost contains several, including
* the type of wave-pattern used to represent ocean, and employed both technically (in maps and charts) and as a decorative element in Asian art and textiles.
* the cloud-band pattern which passes (via a geometrical version used in Islamic art) into the west.
* you will also see on the shoulders of a Samurai figure the sort of pattern used to signify laminae, whether of metal or lacquer.
NB. The examples used in the blog-post date to the 19thC, but use of these customs in Asian art may be traced (as in fact I traced them) to long before the 15thC AD. The history of ideas about frogs and toads I have not treated online, feeling that the only relevant fact was that the amphibian in the Vms was demonstably one associated with the same plant with which it appears in the Vms.
Cheers.
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| Palaeography and modern developments |
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Posted by: Diane - 10-10-2018, 12:41 PM - Forum: Codicology and Paleography
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Newcomers often wonder why so few specialists in disciplines vital to manuscript studies will participate in, or have any association with 'Voynich studies'.
One reason, I think, is that specialists immediately become aware of a general air of outmoded assumptions and theoretical bases where their own discipline is involved - e.g. the 'Voynich' habit of trying to talk in terms of 'national' characters and national boundaries in a way which implies a level of exclusivity inappropriate to our period. Another example, which I've tried to protest for nearly a decade, is the seemingly entrenched (but anachronistic) assumption that literalism is a 'natural' default when discussing images in the Vms - a fault especially pronounced in discussions of the botanical images.
Anyway, about Palaeography..
These days it is recognised that to describe or provenance a script, one needs to take cultural, historical and other factors into account. It's not just a question of classifying something as Secretarial, or Gothic and so on. Such terms as 'German l' sound ok to an amateur but a specialists' teeth are likely to be set on edge (sort of thing).
The good news is this: Litteragothica has begun a series of posts on this subject. I'll add a link to the first installment.
You'll find that the posts are fairly short, full of solid material, and with really excellent sources for deeper study - if you want it.
Kindest regards to all who labour in the field.
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| Sleeve focus thread |
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Posted by: Koen G - 04-10-2018, 09:04 PM - Forum: Imagery
- Replies (115)
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I've been thinking a lot about how we can collectively determine a date range for the Zodiac figures' dress. In another thread I tried to focus on one figure, but soon realized that this wouldn't be the best approach; it leaves too many items open to interpretation. However, while researching my previous blog post, I read something which might be more useful. Apparently sleeves were very much a locus for fashion evolution during the Middle Ages.
Fortune has it that we have two very marked types of sleeves in the VM: wide, dagged ones for women and baggy sleeves for the Archer. If we were to collect examples of each and map the date points, it should be possible to create some kind of heat map for both. On the museum's note about the Devonshire Hunting Tapestries, it says that "Bagpipe sleeves seen in the tapestry went out of fashion around 1430." This provides a hypothetical upper limit for the male dress, which may or may not be challenged by our exercise.
EDIT: I'll make a separate thread for the female dress.
I'll keep the list updated here.
MEN:
- Basel Universitätsbibliothek A II 4, Freiburg, 1400, You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
- Bibliothèque de l'Arsenal Ms-3480, France, 1400-1425, You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
- Bibliothèque de l'Arsenal Ms-5193 réserve, Paris, 1411, You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
- Bibliothèque de l'Arsenal Ms-664 réserve, Paris, 1411, You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
- BL Add MS 18850 (Bedford Hours), Paris, 1423, You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
- BL Add MS 11575, Bruges, 1400-1425, You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
- BL Harley 4431, Paris, 1410-1414, You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
- BL King's 5, Northern Netherlands, 1405, You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
- BL Royal 45, England, ca. 1400, You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
- BL Royal 20 B XX, Paris, 1400-1425, You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
- BNF MS Fr. 23279, Paris, 1410, You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
- BNF MS Fr. 12420, Paris, 1403, You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.=
- BNF MS Fr. 616, Paris, 1405-1409, You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
- BNF MS Fr. 9333, Northern Italy, 1380-1399, You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
- BSB Clm 8201, Bavaria, 1414, You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
- Cod. Pal. germ. 471, Nürnberg, 1425-1431, You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
- Cod. Pal. germ. 794, Schwaben, 1415, You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
- Cotton MS Nero A X/2 (Gawain), England, 1400-1410, You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
- Genève Ms. fr. 57, France, 1402, You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
- Houghton Typ 127, France, 1430, You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.=
- Huntington mssEL 26 C 9, England, 1400-1410, You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
- Morgan MS M.396, Northeastern France, 1425-1430, You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
- Morgan MS M.453, Paris, 1425-1430, You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
- Morgan MS M.245, Paris, 1405, You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
- ÖNB Cod. Ser. n. 2644, North Italy, 1380-1399, You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
- Pal. Lat. 1806, Augsburg, 1400-1430 You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
- Pal. Lat. 1726, Heidelberg, 1423, You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
- Reg. Lat. 1290, Northern Italy, 1420, You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
- Trinity R 15 21, England, 1408, You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
- Werkstatt von 1418, Haguenau (Alsace), 1418 ca., many manuscripts.
- Werkstatt Diebold Lauber, Haguenau (Alsace), 1450 ca., many manuscripts.
- Aquila tower frescos, North Italy, 1400 ca., You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
- Black Palace frescos, Coredo (Trentino), 1460 ca., You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
- Castello della Manta frescos, North-West Italy, 1410-1420, You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
- Devonshire Hunting Tapestries, South Netherlands, 1425-1430, You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
- Fra Angelico, Italy, 1430-1437, various paintings from this period.
- Ortenberg altarpiece, Middle Rhineland, 1420, You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
- Van Eyck's Madonna of Chancellor Rolin, Flanders/Burgundy, 1435, You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
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| A Beginner’s Question: What is EVA-b? |
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Posted by: ChenZheChina - 04-10-2018, 06:14 AM - Forum: Voynich Talk
- Replies (11)
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Hi everyone,
I am wondering one thing: What is EVA-b?
I checked René’s webpage about You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view., which says:
Quote:As it turned out, there were three single characters that might be called unusual because they did not appear in any of the previously defined transcription alphabets, but which occurred more than 10 times in the MS. These three characters: b, u and z were assigned their own 'Basic Eva' letter (b, u and z respectively)
However, I did not see EVA-b or EVA-u on voynichese.com.
Then I checked You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view., and found EVA-u on f89v1 (You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.). At the same spot, voynichese.com recognize this word (du) as ligature an (dan). Though a bit unexpected, at least I’ve found it.
So, the only remaining question is, what is EVA-b?
I checked the original images page-by-page, and found voynichese.com has You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.. To me, the final n’s seem to be EVA-b (b). Is this it? Is voynichese.com, or the transcript they use, systematically transcribe EVA-b as EVA-n? Or, is EVA-b something else that I haven’t found yet?
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![[Image: pattern01.png]](http://wwwhomes.uni-bielefeld.de/mwille2/VMS/pattern01.png)
![[Image: 934px-Pisanello_018.jpg]](https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/23/Pisanello_018.jpg/934px-Pisanello_018.jpg)