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| Are there any traditional ways of indicating scale in mauscript drawings? |
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Posted by: crezac - 01-02-2016, 11:01 PM - Forum: Imagery
- Replies (3)
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I don't see anything in any of the drawings to indicate scale. Possibly scale isn't important. Possibly the scale is mentioned in the text. Maybe all the drawings were recognizable to the authors contemporaries.
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. is often identified as a water lily. If it isn't a water lily something like European wild ginger (asarabacca) is a possibility if it's a smaller plant. I don't see anything to indicate scale, but I know only a little about plant drawings in manuscripts. Can someone who knows more say if there are conventions in drawing to indicate how large the plants are? If not are there ways to estimate the plant sizes based on any of the plant structures?
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| Common points of agreement |
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Posted by: crezac - 31-01-2016, 11:35 PM - Forum: Analysis of the text
- Replies (7)
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There are thousands of pages of analysis, theory, speculation and pure ranting about VMS out there. Some of it conflicting, some of it taken as fact just because it's been taken as fact for decades, some of it interesting but impossible to prove.
What I want to do here is outline some things about VMS which everyone can agree on, mainly so that I have a starting point for my analysis but maybe long term so that when we are discussing VMS someone can say "that's not a point of common agreement" and have a place to reference the claim. I'm limiting myself to the text itself, if someone wants to do something similar for images, the physical manuscript and so on that's fine but I don't want to put any of that in this post.
I'm going to try to limit myself to the facts we know. I may occasionally say that it's reasonable to assume or speculate something. If I start claiming things are "possibly" something, feel free to shoot me down in a comment; there are so many things that are possibilities listing them isn't helpful. I will edit this post if I need to add, modify or delete items on my list.
VMS is written in a set of distinct characters.
There are 25 characters in the set. (attach jpg illustrating each character)
It is not know what any character represents.
More than one character is written in the same place on some pages.
The character set is used to encodes information in strings of these characters.
Character distribution in these strings is ordered, i.e not random.
There is no string of these characters with a known meaning.
The strings are written left to right.
Individual strings can be organized into arrays separated by spaces.
Arrays are permitted to span lines.
Arrays can be used to label images.
Not all arrays are aligned with the left margin.
A blank line can be used to separate arrays.
None of the characters are used as punctuation.
None of the characters are used only as representations of numbers.
Lets see what discussion those generate, if any. I can add more if anyone actually cares enough to comment 
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| Question regarding the original author's birthday |
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Posted by: crezac - 29-01-2016, 04:27 AM - Forum: Provenance & history
- Replies (4)
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VMS has been dated to sometime in the 15th century, or at least the parchment has. It has also been noted that there don't appear to corrected errors, i.e. the author made no mistakes he had to correct. Finally the ink analysis seems to indicated that, while more than one type of ink is used for main text, page numbers and some marginalia, it is all consistent with a 15th century origin.
Page numbers weren't common in early manuscripts. Their earliest uses appear to be when making a copy of a manuscript to ensure the copy and original were ordered the same. This would be especially important if one couldn't read the original. If you wanted to work on understanding what the original meant you would want your own copy. And your copy would include marginalia from the original.
If the artist were likewise copying images of plants he had never seen from an earlier work that might account for the fact that none of the plants are easily recognizable from the drawings.
Obviously the only way to prove this would be to find an earlier copy of VMS. But, purely for purposes of discussion, if VMS is someones workng copy of an earlier manuscript, how much will that impact any attempts at a translation?
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| The Nine Rosettes and Kabbalah |
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Posted by: Oocephalus - 27-01-2016, 09:45 PM - Forum: Imagery
- Replies (29)
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I have seen some speculations (sorry, don't remember by whom) that the Nine Rosettes foldout in the VMS might be connected to the You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. symbol in the Kabbalah. However, this has been dismissed because the number of Sephirot (aspects of God) depicted in the tree is always ten, while that of the rosettes is nine. I still think there may be a connection. The Sephirot are thought to be associated with the celestial spheres, with the lowest one, Malkhut, being associated with Earth. In the upper right corner of the foldout there is a T-O map, a symbol of Earth, connected to the upper right rosette. So the T-O map could depict Malkhut, while the rosettes could show the other Sephirot. If so, the diagram must be read with upper right as bottom and lower left as top.
This could also explain the symbol in the lower left of the foldout. In the book "Origins of the Kabbalah" by Gershom Scholem, a doctrine is mentioned that originated in a work falsely attributed to Hai Gaon, which was probably written in Provence about 1230. This work tried to reconcile the ten sephirot with an older doctrine called the thirteen middoth. He postulated that above the Sephirot there was the "root of all roots", which contained three "hidden lights" called the primordial, the transparent, and the clear light. This might have been influenced by the Christian concept of the Trinity.
Could this "root of all roots" be the symbol in the lower left corner? What do people think who know more about Kabbalah than I do?
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