The Voynich Ninja

(22-09-2016, 01:42 AM)stellar Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.

(21-09-2016, 10:35 PM)-JKP- Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.Stellar, I think you completely missed my point.

I known all about Orion, Pleiades, etc. I'm quite familiar with the constellations... I can identify many of them on sight, and have a fairly good quality telescope to view them.


What I'm saying, (besides the fact that there are other ways to interpret seven stars) is that you assigned a different VMS word token to Taurus than other people who have gone down this same road and you imposed the "4" glyph on the letter "a".

So, to support your assertions:

1. You need to justify why you turned the "a" into a "4", otherwise people might think you did so to make your numbers come out the way you want them.
   
2. You need to explain why you disagree with the labels assigned by previous researchers and switched them around.
   

You and I are not the scribe and in fact people have even miss interpreted plain language like old Hebrew and Aramaic translations of the Bible.  The fact is I see a 4 and I know its tail is barely visible yet the slopes do not resemble a voynich letter, "a".  I did find Aldebaran and Tauros using my numerology method.  The cluster picture for Pleiade is similar and so I'm asserting its a 4.  I disagree with Stephen Bax's work and his interpretations yet he does assert this section to be Taurus and believes the glyph we are debating on is a voynich letter, "a".

see attachment:

Stellar, you can't just go by the shape when it's within something like a wheel where the scribe is continually turning the page to try to write in the correct direction. There are more malformed (but still recognizable) shapes in the circular drawings than anywhere else. If you examine them closely, some are almost sideways (I've noticed the scribe was reluctant to rotate the page until absolutely necessary).


So, you have to examine context as well. I think it looks more like an "a" than a "4" but I would not base my assertion simply on that. You also have to study the script as a whole and see where, why, and how, and with what the "4" is usually written. The context is wrong compared to all the other "4" glyphs in the manuscript, but it fits well with the usual context of the "a", so the evidence, if you stop cherry-picking and start looking at the manuscript in its entirety, is stronger in the direction of "a" than "4".

(22-09-2016, 01:49 AM)-JKP- Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.

(22-09-2016, 01:42 AM)stellar Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.

(21-09-2016, 10:35 PM)-JKP- Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.Stellar, I think you completely missed my point.

I known all about Orion, Pleiades, etc. I'm quite familiar with the constellations... I can identify many of them on sight, and have a fairly good quality telescope to view them.


What I'm saying, (besides the fact that there are other ways to interpret seven stars) is that you assigned a different VMS word token to Taurus than other people who have gone down this same road and you imposed the "4" glyph on the letter "a".

So, to support your assertions:

1. You need to justify why you turned the "a" into a "4", otherwise people might think you did so to make your numbers come out the way you want them.
   
2. You need to explain why you disagree with the labels assigned by previous researchers and switched them around.
   

You and I are not the scribe and in fact people have even miss interpreted plain language like old Hebrew and Aramaic translations of the Bible.  The fact is I see a 4 and I know its tail is barely visible yet the slopes do not resemble a voynich letter, "a".  I did find Aldebaran and Tauros using my numerology method.  The cluster picture for Pleiade is similar and so I'm asserting its a 4.  I disagree with Stephen Bax's work and his interpretations yet he does assert this section to be Taurus and believes the glyph we are debating on is a voynich letter, "a".

see attachment:

Stellar, you can't just go by the shape when it's within something like a wheel where the scribe is continually turning the page to try to write in the correct direction. There are more malformed (but still recognizable) shapes in the circular drawings than anywhere else. If you examine them closely, some are almost sideways (I've noticed the scribe was reluctant to rotate the page until absolutely necessary).


So, you have to examine context as well. I think it looks more like an "a" than a "4" but I would not base my assertion simply on that. You also have to study the script as a whole and see where, why, and how, and with what the "4" is usually written. The context is wrong compared to all the other "4" glyphs in the manuscript, but it fits well with the usual context of the "a", so the evidence, if you stop cherry-picking and start looking at the manuscript in its entirety, is stronger in the direction of "a" than "4".

Now this is a shocker so your argument made me think. I still think the glyph can go either way yet you do have a point about this word and the position of the what maybe be a 4 or and A.

Well this satisfies both cases:



Update to Numerology chart:



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This table has always caught my eye within folio 1r.  Now I believe its a numerology table which is incomplete and barely visible.  There is addition and 2 voynich glyphs which have equivalences to the numerology table I made.

(24-09-2016, 08:42 PM)stellar Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.This table has always caught my eye within folio 1r.  Now I believe its a numerology table which is incomplete and barely visible.  There is addition and 2 voynich glyphs which have equivalences to the numerology table I made.

What you've labeled as a bench char is the letter a (in the first column) and a figure-8 in the second column.

There's no question about the first char being "a" because the column shows almost a complete alphabet in normal sequence. I've colorized the letters so they show up better in this blog entry:

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You have convinced me and yet another find.  I read your blog and I do think this maybe an attempt by someone to crack the voynich back in history.  These letters A-C are actually part of a PI system of numerology.

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When you find a word using this number system 91% of Welsh words are stripped out automatically.  Then the image is compared to the Voynich word and it has a chance of 9% of the remaining Welsh dictionary. But the percentages are less than that, because the word is targeting an image and both the welsh word and the voynich word have to be equal.  So in essence its narrowed down to 3% for a chance of a fit.  Now in these posts you will find a Zodiac which all but one word is in Welsh and I don't know what the percentages of finding that fit is!  So here it is again.  However I will try .03x.12=.36% so I had a .36% chance of fitting a Zodiac in.
 
The people who are arguing against my method are not taking this into consideration.  If all languages don't work based on rules to decoded the voynich than the argument for a number system is high for my method.

I started with Leo, because that's my sign.
The zodiac sign Leo in Welsh is y Llew (lit, Lion). You've translated it as Cenau, which properly means cub or pup.
You seem to have done this for all the signs - you've found a Welsh word that has a vague approximation to the meaning you're trying to force upon it and that has a number value you need.

I mean, why would Pisces be "water" and not y Pysgod?

(27-10-2016, 06:27 PM)davidjackson Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.I started with Leo, because that's my sign.
The zodiac sign Leo in Welsh is y Llew (lit, Lion). You've translated it as Cenau, which properly means cub or pup.
You seem to have done this for all the signs - you've found a Welsh word that has a vague approximation to the meaning you're trying to force upon it and that has a number value you need.

I mean, why would Pisces be "water" and not y Pysgod?

You've put your finger exactly on the problem, David.

Cherry-picking the results to support the theory is bass-ackwards. The data should lead to the results not the results being extracted to fit the theory.

Can I say, Tom - I am always impressed by your perseverance and your continual striving to figure out the mystery of the code. You have continued to go forward when many people have given up.

I think David's critique is a fair one - if we are not limited to the Welsh noun for "Pisces", but can also add or subtract the definite article (y), use alternate spellings, and count attributes like "water", then the system may be too loose. It is hard to disprove that we've found anything specific, because anything at all can be found under this system. That is why I am a little skeptical. But perhaps I've misinterpreted. At any rate, your effort is commendable!

(27-10-2016, 06:27 PM)davidjackson Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.I started with Leo, because that's my sign.
The zodiac sign Leo in Welsh is y Llew (lit, Lion). You've translated it as Cenau, which properly means cub or pup.
You seem to have done this for all the signs - you've found a Welsh word that has a vague approximation to the meaning you're trying to force upon it and that has a number value you need.

I mean, why would Pisces be "water" and not y Pysgod?

I'm not forcing anything yet I did have to correct Aquarius and Leo.  The number system verifies this and yes as you know with the Voynich everything is trial by error until you get it right.  I believe you were referring to Aquarius which is now the Water Carrier as is should be; Pisces is the Fish as Cameg.  Leo is now llewon which is plural for lion.

For some reason the Author did not use a welsh word for scorpion yet, "scorpion" is a 1, maybe its his encoding trick because the welsh word for garlic is, "craf" which shares the same glyph's as, "scorpion".