The Voynich Ninja

(21-11-2016, 06:35 AM)stellar Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.I don't call it guess work!  I call it intuition. 

One might object that those are the same thing

Quote:The paragraphs are highly speculative

So they are not repeatable.

This is the flaw in this method. It only works when the translator has been given a language to stick to and a list of possible words that match the drawing. 
Each word in the manuscript is a number. Let's say a label is 5. There are thousands of words in Wels and English that match 5. And millions upon millions in other languages. We can only find the same solution if you tell us what you want us to find...

(21-11-2016, 06:35 AM)stellar Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.I don't call it guess work!  I call it intuition. 

I've been lucky enough to meet a lot of very smart people. Very, very smart. Most of them agree that science is 1% inspiration, 99% perspiration.


Writing a novel is the same. The idea is key, it's everything, without an original idea (or an original means of expressing it), you are fighting an uphill battle and usually doomed to failure, but no matter how good the idea... putting the words on the page is still 99% of the work.

The same with research. A great idea is important, but if it can't be substantiated, replicated, or defended, it means nothing. Great research is usually built on a firm foundation. Your foundation is extremely shaky. No knowledge of medieval paleography, no knowledge of medieval languages, no apparent knowledge of 14th- and 15th-century history, little-to-no knowledge of Dee and you clearly didn't understand the history of numerology, of gematria, or how the correspondence between letters and numbers began.

You're playing darts in the dark, hoping to land a bull's-eye so you don't have to do the knuckle-crunching background work involved in making a genuine discovery.

OK, so the first step in the procedure (of translation from Voynichese to plain text) is to take the Voynichese word, consult the numerology chart above and place a number into correspondence of each Voynich glyph in this vord. For example, if the vord consists of ten glyphs, then we'll have a sequence of ten numbers.

Am I correct? If yes, then what's the next step?

Let's consider the latest screenshot above, e.g. the vord oteeol. I understand how oteeol expands to 685565, but how does 685565 yield 8? When I open the calculator page, I am at a loss, since I don't understand what fields and buttons to use and what's the principle behind the calculation.

Anton, this numerology is basically "modulo 9" arithmetic.

This means that for any number, you figure out what is the "rest" if you divide by 9.

Take the number 48. This is 5*9 + 3, so the "rest" term, when dividing by 9 is 3.

For large numbers, this rest term can be quickly obtained by adding the digits of the number, and if that is greater than 9, just add again and keep on adding. For 48, 4 plus 8 is 12, and then 1 plus 2 is 3.

Such a sum is always in the range 1-9, while the modulo term is 0-8. One just has to understand that 0 and 9
are equivalent.
In this type arithmetic, the order of adding makes no difference.
There are alll sorts of fascinating mathematical theorems about this, but that's outside the scope of this topic.

You sum the numbers until you get <10. So...

6+8+5+5+6+5=35
3+5=8

Fun, isn't it? Numerology is better with gematria based languages like Greek or Hebrew (or Japanese). It's fairly pointless for most European languages because they aren't gematria.

(Whoops, Rene already answered. )

Thanks Rene and David.

So to continue the example, for the second step of the procedure, we add numbers as follows:

2a) 6 + 8 + 5 + 5 + 6 + 5 = 35
2b) 3 + 5 = 8.

So we get number 8 in the second step.

What is the third step, then? How does 8 expand into "ERFAGAF"? I understand that "ERFAGAF" can be "translated" into "8" using the numerology chart for the Latin alphabet. I also understand that "ERFAGAF" is a Welsh word, and that it is postulated (without any proof) that the plain text is Welsh.

But I have two questions:

1) How the word "ERFAGAF" is picked out of the multitude of Welsh words which count into 8?

2) Given that oteeol is six characters long, and ERFAGAF is seven characters long, it is apparent that the number of characters does not need to match between Voynichese and Welsh in the "numerology" method. This noted, why does the method constrain itself to picking only a single Welsh word for each Voynichese word? Why can't a phrase (consisting of two, three or more Welsh words) be picked? This, again, is postulated without any proof.

(21-11-2016, 10:14 PM)Anton Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.Thanks Rene and David.

So to continue the example, for the second step of the procedure, we add numbers as follows:

2a) 6 + 8 + 5 + 5 + 6 + 5 = 35
2b) 3 + 5 = 8.

So we get number 8 in the second step.

What is the third step, then? How does 8 expand into "ERFAGAF"? I understand that "ERFAGAF" can be "translated" into "8" using the numerology chart for the Latin alphabet. I also understand that "ERFAGAF" is a Welsh word, and that it is postulated (without any proof) that the plain text is Welsh.

But I have two questions:

1) How the word "ERFAGAF" is picked out of the multitude of Welsh words which count into 8?

2) Given that oteeol is six characters long, and ERFAGAF is seven characters long, it is apparent that the number of characters does not need to match between Voynichese and Welsh in the "numerology" method. This noted, why does the method constrain itself to picking only a single Welsh word for each Voynichese word? Why can't a phrase (consisting of two, three or more Welsh words) be picked? This, again, is postulated without any proof.

The third step is that Stellar guesses what the subject matter might be from the pictures and then looks up a bunch of words related to that subject matter (e.g., Adam and Eve or Jonah story) to see which ones have the same numeric equivalent and then (fourth step) matches them to VMS vords with the same value.

He recently added an additional step. If he couldn't find a word that matched, he turned one or more of the glyphs into nulls.


So, as far as I can tell, it works like this... Stellar "identified" the "Adam and Eve" story based on seeing a snake in the roots of a big-plant drawing and then proceeds as follows:

1. Assign numeric values to the VMS glyphs according to Stellar's number chart. Each VMS vord will add up to a number and break down to a single digit.
2. If that digit is 9, then look up biblical-related words that add up to 9 by plugging Welsh words into the online Pythagorean numerology generator. If they add up to 9, then choose the one that might help the sentence make some sense related to an assumed biblical passage.
3. Keep going with the other vords that break down to numbers between 1 and 8.
4. If they don't add any sense to the sentence, turn them into nulls (cross them out).


This is the numerology calculator and Welsh dictionary he is using to look up the word-number equivalents. You look up a word in Welsh and then plug it into the calculator to get the number value:


Welsh Dictionary

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Numerology Calculator
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The method cannot be defended and every person using it will get different results. The number equivalents are arbitrary, the language (Welsh) is assumed, biblical Welsh is quite a bit different from modern Welsh and he's using a modern Welsh dictionary, the style of numerology (Pythagorean) is assumed and, since there are thousands of words that add up to the same digits, the word assignments are completely subjective based on assumptions about what the drawings mean.

Well that reminds me of an example in the Bennett's book: if you get a team of monkeys striking the typewriter keys in a random manner forever, then once upon a time they would be able to produce "Hamlet", "War And Peace" and any other past and future text ever created by humanity. That's simply because "forever's a very long time", as the song has it.

For another example (if I'm not mistaken it's Bertrand Russel's), each irrational number (such as pi) would contain encoded version of "Hamlet", "War And Peace" etc. somewhere along the way after its decimal point. For sure, decryption of the VMS is also to be found there. Just a bit of patience is needed.

(22-11-2016, 01:46 AM)Anton Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.Well that reminds me of an example in the Bennett's book: if you get a team of monkeys striking the typewriter keys in a random manner forever, then once upon a time they would be able to produce "Hamlet", "War And Peace" and any other past and future text ever created by humanity. That's simply because "forever's a very long time", as the song has it.

For another example (if I'm not mistaken it's Bertrand Russel's), each irrational number (such as pi) would contain encoded version of "Hamlet", "War And Peace" etc. somewhere along the way after its decimal point. For sure, decryption of the VMS is also to be found there. Just a bit of patience is needed.

[off-topic]

There is a similar saying in the US: "If you throw a stick of dynamite into enough printing companies, eventually you will get the Declaration of Independence."

[/off-topic]

In the lower left of Ros 2 is a symbol known to alchemy as Aqua Vita.  I have to ask if my numerology is incorrect then why does the diagonal line of VMS words add to a 2 like Aqua Vita?  Aqua Vita is a form of alcohol.  Also Dee probably with the aid of Kelly distilled some Aqua Vita for King Rudolf II.  Very close to the Aqua Vita symbol is the Prague Wall.  This could be evidence that the Voynich Manuscript was Authored perhaps during the time Dee and Kelly were in Prague.

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