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No text, but a visual code

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• No text, but a visual code

• RE: No text, but a visual code

  Koen G > 03-10-2024, 07:18 AM

  It's a good idea, but I think some concrete examples will be required to make it more convincing.

• RE: No text, but a visual code

  Antonio García Jiménez > 03-10-2024, 07:33 PM

  What I mean is that I do not have a theory of the script, but a theory of the codex in its entirety as a unit of meaning. Since I believe that iconography only reflects the influence of the stars on plants, my theory of the script is consistent with that idea, since for me it is only an astronomical notation system that the authors use as a game.
  
  On the other hand, the fact that the script is just that and not a text is consistent with the herbs we see, most of which are the fruit of the authors' imagination. There is nothing to say about them because nothing is known about those plants, which are just a colored drawing.
  
  To be more specific, I believe that the inclined lines of the script, up to three of them, are what we see in the so-called clock on the Rosettes page, in the loops of some gallows and in some other object of imagery

• RE: No text, but a visual code

  Antonio García Jiménez > 19-10-2024, 07:07 PM

  There are a number of reasons to rule out that the Voynich script hides a language, whether natural or encrypted. There is a reason that I particularly like because it is visually perceived how the glyphs only serve to fill in gaps without the chain of glyphs having any phonetic meaning.
  
  Let's look at this diagram for example (f67v1):
  
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  All the closed rectangles that form the two circles are filled with glyphs in such a way that they do not leave any gaps.  You might think that the authors have chosen words that fill just these spaces, but it is absurd. What happens in my opinion, as I have said before, is that glyphs are like Lego pieces. They can be put on and taken off at will.
  
  The latter also seems absurd, but only if you think about a phonetic system. If you think of independent symbols with their own meaning, the script turns out to be like a game for the authors. They play with astronomical objects and positions. Now I put a moon, now a star nearby, now I remove it, now I put another star close to the sun, now move the moon's position and so on. The script would be nothing more than an astronomical alphabet.

• RE: No text, but a visual code

  ReneZ > 19-10-2024, 11:54 PM

  This is an unusual post....
  
  I don't mean that the link does not work (You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.).
  The problem is that the world's libraries are full with such circular diagrams, where circle segments are filled with words that fit into the available space.
  
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• RE: No text, but a visual code

  R. Sale > 20-10-2024, 01:25 AM

  See also: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.

• RE: No text, but a visual code

  Antonio García Jiménez > 20-10-2024, 05:23 PM

  R. Sale, your examples are useless because there are no closed segments in your circles. As for the ReneZ examples, in the first diagram I see the months of the year; they fit the segment using abbreviations, and in the second diagram there are unfilled blanks.
  
  What I explain is just one more of the reasons why the script is not a linguistic system. There are of course more compelling reasons such as the line as a functional unit (LAAFU effect), the rare distribution of single-legged gallows, the fact that most paragraphs begin with a gallow, the lack of repeated phrases, the ambiguity of the spaces...
  
  There is also what I call the filling effect, like the example I gave in the diagram or others in which the spaces between the elements of the drawing are filled, like in this example of f93v:
  
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• RE: No text, but a visual code

  Ruby Novacna > 20-10-2024, 11:53 PM

  (19-10-2024, 07:07 PM)Antonio García Jiménez Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view....The script would be nothing more than an astronomical alphabet.

  
  In my opinion, the text is long enough for everyone to find some evidence for their personal theory.

• RE: No text, but a visual code

  ReneZ > 21-10-2024, 12:39 AM

  (20-10-2024, 05:23 PM)Antonio García Jiménez Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.As for the ReneZ examples, in the first diagram I see the months of the year; they fit the segment using abbreviations, and in the second diagram there are unfilled blanks.
  
  What I explain is just one more of the reasons why the script is not a linguistic system.

  
  I am sorry, but my examples are linguistic. They show that your argument is invalid.
  
  Please note also that the words in the segments on f67r1 are not all the same length. The markers fit around them.

• RE: No text, but a visual code

  Antonio García Jiménez > 21-10-2024, 01:00 PM

  And what about the example of You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. that I gave before?
  
  By what mysterious mechanism do the supposed words fit into the gaps left by the flowers?
  
  If the drawings came before the script, as is commonly accepted, do we have to think that the scribe is writing the text and just the right words fall into the gaps? It doesn't seem reasonable.

• RE: No text, but a visual code

  R. Sale > 21-10-2024, 06:49 PM

  It doesn't matter. Either the scribe works around the drawings, or s/he needs to leave spaces where the illustrations will go. Either way, it's the same result. Sometimes words are split by drawings similar to examples at lines' ends.
  
  My examples were intended to demonstrate the wide variety of prior sources showing text in circular bands. Not all bands are filled with words. So what? What is so special about circular text in "closed segments"? It's just a matter of the quantity of words, not something that is qualitatively different. And a bit of 'practice' perhaps. When the space is filled, just quit and move on. 
  
  Scribal hand #4 in the VMs Zodiac sequence had no problem in creating closed text segments, - with the exception of three examples: White Aries (2) and Cancer (1). That's another investigation.
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