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+--- Thread: No text, but a visual code (/thread-2384.html)
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No text, but a visual code - Antonio García Jiménez - 23-05-2018
Hello everyone,
I think there is not a language in the Voynich. No letters, no alphabet, nothing phonetic. It is only a visual code, an astronomical-astrological code which indicate the location of the stars in the celestial sphere. Each star of the Zodiac provide its virtue to an herb, therefore was very important identify well the stars
RE: No text, but a visual code - Antonio García Jiménez - 23-05-2018
Hello again,
In the attached document, I explain some symbols of the Voynich
Thank you
RE: No text, but a visual code - Davidsch - 24-05-2018
Hello Antonio García Jiménez, I think it's a nice theory, but could you help me find the followings things:
1. gallows in Liber de quindecim stellis, where?
2. The c-symbol in the Catalan Atlas as symbol for the moon?
As far as I know that is not true. If so, where exactly?
This is the symbol of the Moon: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
3. P and F in Libro de las Cruces? Please provides examples.
RE: No text, but a visual code - Antonio García Jiménez - 24-05-2018
Hello Davidsch,
The gallow (T) is one of the fifteen magic talimans. You can see it in British Library Royal MS 12 E XXV, f. 164.
There are two of them, one above the other. I think (T) is the Mid-Heaven at noon
I haven't said that c-symbol is in Catalan Atlas. Only that this work uses a picture whit the lunar mansions for locating the stars, and I think is the Voynich method and © and its variants are the lunar days
You can see in the World Digital Library the Libro de las Cruces p. 24. The cauda draconis is like a tail and I think the tail de P and F is the dragon tail.
In You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. of the Voynich we can see a dragon.The string of symbols starts just with a eclipse sign
RE: No text, but a visual code - Davidsch - 25-05-2018
Thank you for clarification
1) the first link: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
These magical diagrams are nothing like the gallows in the Voynich, and have no significance at all towards the Voynich manuscript in my opinion.
RE: No text, but a visual code - -JKP- - 25-05-2018
I have the same feeling about it. I think the similarity is probably coincidental.
Angelic writings, symbols of constellations, alchemical symbols, kabbalistic symbols, all have a lot of lines with loops on the ends. It was the traditional way to draw many of these "magical" power symbols.
But the loops in the VMS are not frequent (only a few glyphs have them) and they are similar to the loops in medieval scripts (especially Latin and Greek abbreviations) and do not necessarily have a connection to kabbalistic or other magical symbols.
RE: No text, but a visual code - Antonio García Jiménez - 25-05-2018
The third magical character from below resembles the gallow T, and in f67v2 of the Voynich we can see drawn planetary diagrams.
The scribe of the Voynich chooses this strange set o glyphs because he believed in the power of Magic. Why if not? It is about to attract the influence of stars to the herbs. It is astrological medicine, natural Magic. In the Middle Ages religious people like Roger Bacon and Albertus Magnus believed in natural Magic and the occult powers of Nature.
I think that the so-called text of the Voynich is a string of astrological symbols and some numbers. The search of a language has given no achievement in centuries. Let's try another way. A cultural product from XV century in Europe must have a solution
RE: No text, but a visual code - -JKP- - 26-05-2018
(25-05-2018, 04:50 PM)Antonio García Jiménez Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.The third magical character from below resembles the gallow T, and in f67v2 of the Voynich we can see drawn planetary diagrams.
The scribe of the Voynich chooses this strange set o glyphs because he believed in the power of Magic....
Antonio, are you familiar with medieval scribal conventions? The shapes may seem strange to a modern eye, but they are NOT strange to the medieval eye. It is the way they are arranged within the tokens that is strange, not the shapes.
And just so you know, not everyone is assuming the VMS is natural language (words). Many of us are looking for other options of what it might represent.
I'm supportive of your work in the sense that you are trying to go from the glyphs to what it means (instead of the other way around), it's a better way to do it, but you still have to interpret some of the text according to your theory in order to confirm or deny whether the idea is correct.
RE: No text, but a visual code - Antonio García Jiménez - 27-05-2018
Thank you JKP, you are right
As a librarian in Biblioteca Nacional de España, I've seen many medieval manuscripts in different languages and is true that the shapes of glyphs are not very strange for medieval time, but I've followed these premises:
The experienced scribe or scribes did the glyphs similar to letters
The Voynich was examined in the XVII century by many learned men more acquainted with medieval scripts than us
The manuscript was sent to Athanasius Kircher because everyone new that him was the best expert in egiptian script and suspected that this text could be a form of hieroglyphs. Kircher believed also in the influence of the stars
Since 1912 when the Voynich was discovered no one have found a language
I think the Voynich is the work of a school of astrological medicine and that more books with the same text were
written, but they don't survive to the Inquisition because its magical shape
RE: No text, but a visual code - Antonio García Jiménez - 30-05-2018
I think that any theory must based in evident clues, things that everyone can see.
If I say that the ghyph (o), the most common one of the Voynich, represents each of the 360 grades of the celestial sphere is because I've seen it. And you can see it too if you look f70r1. At the top, in the circumference, there are a sequence of ooooooooo followed by others signs. Can this string be a word? Of course not.
One of the these glyphs is (a) in EVA alphabet, and I think that it is also (o) but with a little tail indicating that the grade is in planetary conjunction. In this case with ®, ghyph that is other variation of the Moon sign, one of the 28 lunar days.
The planetary aspects of the Astrology you can see it in f67v2. Here you can see The Sun and the Moon and its reciprocal distances represented with the aspects in the corners : trigono (120º), sextil (60º), opposition (180º) and quadrature (90º).
There is other planetary aspect: Quincuncio (150º) whose sign is the known table of the Voynich
Please, don't forget that Astrology was a very respectable science in the colleges in the XV century