Why and how the text could be Bavarian
#77
I was interested to see whether applying the existing theoretical cipher would reveal a German structure. So I took a look at folio f51r, which I believed to be Alraune/mandrake. First, the Rules, and then the result:


Rules: 
ch=n, y=e/y (y at the end of a word can also remain y, cf. bair ‘sey’), d=s/ts/tz/z/ss (sharp s), o→o (can also be u), sh→sch, tsh→tsch
l=l,  r=r, e=e (not yet deciphered)
ee= eu /au / ou
"o" at the beginning of a word = absorbed article, concrete article guessed
"o" in the middle =  o / u (Bavarian vowel instability)
"qo" at the beginning of a word = absorbed preposition+article, concrete wording guessed
"y" at the beginning of a word = absorbed verb prefix ge/ver/be
"aiin" = "en", standing alone aiin = ein/ain

Gallows t k p f and Bank Gallows ckh cph cfh remain unchanged, plain text unknown

Result

L1 tsholdchy       qotchy    opchear    ypchedy 
    t schusslne in die tne die pchear   gepchese

L2 dcheodaiin ckheody ckhody chody
      sneosen   ckheose  ckhose nose

L3 ydchody ckhey oty ckheodar qoky 
     gesnose ckhee ote ckheosr in die ke

L4 daiinces    okol   cheody ckhy cheeey 
     sences    die kol neose    ckhe neeee

L5 tcheody  qodaiin        okeey       qockhey  taiin 
     tneose von dem sen die keee in die ckhee  ten

L6 ycho  daiin chokaiin ykchodaiin ykald 
     verno tsen  noken  geknosen  gekals

L7 ychos ar eeckhy kcho   qokchy      qotal 
     genos r  eenkhe kno  in die kne  von dem tl

L8    oshol   odaiin    ckhey ckheody   qokey            otydy 
      die schol das sen ckhey ckheose   von dem kee das tysy

L9  tol  daiin     daim      qchodal   dal  qody        qoetam 
      tol  tsen      sem  von dem nosl sal in die tse in die etam

L10 ykchol  dor  shey    qokeol        kchey shol   okam 
       verknol sor schey von dem keol knee schol die kam

L11 tchodaiinoeody  qokol          oteodaiin kol  otag 
        tnosenoeose  von dem kol die teosen kol die tag

L12  yoees   ckheey kol cheeal    okeor    qockhey   pchodal 
        geoeus ckheue kol  naul   die keor in die ckhee  pnotsal

L13 oaiin ckhol ykieol   otchey  cpheo daiin ykeoldy 
       ein   ckhol gekieol die tnee cpheo sen gekeoltse

L14 daiiithy    qodaiin       kaiiidal cphodal s al dam 
       tsenithe von dem sen kensl     cphosl s al tsam

L15 qokol             cheor   ckhal s or aldy otal 
       von dem kol    neor   ckhal  s or alse die tal


It is, of course, difficult to comment on such a rough text, but the structure shows certain similarities to the structure of Middle High German texts. The articles and prepositions are well balanced, and it would be possible to form reasonable sentences from the surrounding words. In this respect, this small experiment, even with a very limited sample size, confirms that this classification could be correct.


For example this sentence:
die schol das sen ckhey ckheose von dem ke das tysy 
= die soll das sein ckhey ckheose von dem ke das tysy
(this what is ckhee ckheose  from kee that tysy)

The problem is that many of you don't speak German and therefore can't “experience” it for yourselves. That's a bit of a shame.

---------------
Pure Eisigesis

You know I'm not a fan of Eisigesis (reading meanings into texts), but just for fun, let's do it here. (This is not a serious translation!)

tschusslne (in my opinion, the t at the Gallow at the beginning of each page is either a zero, just to make a nice symbol, or an abbreviation for an instruction: do, take, etc. 

That leaves schusslne – unfortunately, that doesn't fit with mandrake at all. But since I'm assuming a phonetic language, and the o can actually be not only u but also “ü,” it would be schüsslne = Schlüssel (key) = Schlüsselblume (key flower). In "Breslauer-Arzneibuch" "Primula veris. himmel-sluzel" (key to heaven) [The flowers match, the leaves (well, with a lot of imagination), the roots don't match so well, although rhizomes are also formed.]

tne could be tine /tinne, the i is phonetically slurred, tinne is a medieval vessel.

Then it would be something like: “tue Schlüsselblumen in die Tinne” = “put keyflowers in the Tinne”

Then there is an article, so the sentence would have to continue something like this: “die [irgendetwas wie] stark gepresst” “that [something like] strong pressed”

It's funny that then it says "sneosen", which is almost certainly “schnäuzen” (to blow one's nose), and a little later it says “nose” "Nase" in modern German, but in Bavarian it also means nose, as in English.

Well, if you look at the effects of key flower:

It contains saponins (soap-like plant substances) which:
loosen mucus
make coughing easier
help with bronchitis


Is this the ultimate proof? Have I now solved the VMS?  Big Grin Big Grin Big Grin

No, sorry, but it's just eisegesis in its purest form, albeit a funny one.

Let's stick to the facts: theoretically, the absorption chiffer presented here could represent a German/bairischen text well.
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RE: Why and how the text could be Bavarian - by JoJo_Jost - 26-02-2026, 08:44 AM

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