(11-04-2019, 09:54 AM)MarcoP Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. (08-04-2019, 02:05 AM)geoffreycaveney Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.I begin with the simplest and least interesting label words: The leftmost labels of the top row of You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. and the middle row of You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. .
leftmost top row label You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. :
[otorchety]
leftmost middle row label You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. :
[otoram]
my readings:
"o-khoriik[o]s"
"o-khorAs"
[Note: For practical purposes I have been treating the Voynich characters [m] and [g] as alternate characters for [y] for some time now. I have added them to my own provisional working letter correspondence table. I have certainly never interpreted [m] and [g] in any other way in any previous readings or interpretations.]
my interpretations:
ο χωρικ[ο]ς
ο χωρος
translations:
"the rustic/regional/village/country"
"the field/farm/estate ; the country/land/region"
Comments:
These are perfectly normal standard Greek words, and perfectly appropriate as labels for plant roots and leaves, although I admit that personally I find these particular labels rather pedestrian, boring, and not terribly informative: I would think such descriptions would apply to an awful lot of plant roots and leaves. Be that as it may, I see nothing wrong with either of these label words.
It's not surprising that you too are beginning to find your results boring. I totally agree that they are. In my opinion this is because your "anything goes" approach doesn't really offer any challenge. Here you pick up the first two random words that you think look somehow similar and you are done: "perfectly appropriate as labels"! Bang!
There would be so many non-boring things to say, if one wanted to look deeper into things!
E.g.:- is it common to see the definite article before labels in Greek manuscripts?
- is it common to see adjectives used as labels in Greek manuscripts?
- is definite article + adjective a combination that can stand on its own (e.g. as a title)?
- which plant categories (if any) were used in medieval Greek (or Hebrew) works?
- which labels appear next to containers in Greek manuscripts (such as You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.)?
- is the label "the field" something that can be seen on Medieval/Renaissance pharmacy jars (in any language)?
I sincerely appreciate the fact that Marco is studying and learning about reading and interpreting medieval Greek manuscripts. This is highly valuable and useful knowledge and information for all of us, whether one agrees or disagrees with my theory, and greater knowledge of such subjects on both sides of the argument can only benefit the discussion.
Ultimately, such questions will need to be answered by a professional specialist scholar in the field. Now I don't believe it is wise or prudent at this stage of the research to go asking a dozen or so such scholars on various such subjects to take the time and effort to answer such individual particular detailed questions, yet. If I make progress with my theory and my research, the appropriate time to reach out for professional feedback on many such subjects will arrive in due course. I do not want to rush or hurry the process prematurely.
I can make just a couple basic comments in reply to Marco's questions for now:
The Voynich MS, whatever it is, is a strange and unique document. Its script is different than anything else that anyone has ever seen, as far as we know. So it is possible that the types of labels it uses, for pharmacy jars or for anything else, are also different from typical or common or normal or standard such labels of such things in medieval Greek manuscripts or any other type of manuscripts.
I agree that the evidence would be stronger, the more similar the types of labels are, but at the same time, having somewhat different types of labels would not necessarily be convincing evidence that the reading and interpretation must be wrong, either. (N.B.: For an example of "convincing evidence that a reading and interpretation is wrong", see my recent critical commentary on the Book Pahlavi theory of the Voynich MS that has been presented in another recent series of papers.)
About the Greek root word of the two label names you ask about here, this is not just some random Greek word for "the field" that I found in the back of a dictionary somewhere. The word "
χωρα" is a basic and important Greek word, with meanings such as "place, region, country", and many further related meanings by extension: "piece of land", "country, countryside" (opposite of the town), etc. The words I read and interpret in these two labels are derived from this basic root. One meaning of "
χωρος" is even "northeast wind". Could the label perhaps refer to plants from some northeast region? I don't know, but it's possible. And "
χωρικος" is clearly the adjective derived from "
χωρος". An alternate interpretation could be that the labels refer to wild plants as opposed to cultivated plants. I am certain that others can evaluate the subtleties of the meanings of the botanical terminology better than I can; for now I am just making my best effort to read and interpret the words themselves.
About the Greek grammar: The definite article is ubiquitous in Greek. One scholar of Greek described its role by saying that basically, you can put the definite article in front of any Greek word and it makes the word a noun. Of course this is an exaggeration, but it illustrates the ubiquitous role of the definite article in Greek.
Geoffrey