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Just a hoax?
- Just a hoax?
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RE: Just a hoax?
Rafal > 11 hours ago
Quote:PS. Since your user name is just "Rafal" and you are here in the Voynich playpen, I always assumed that you were Rafal Prinke, which I knew from the old Voynich mailing list days. But now I see you are not, correct?
Yes, I am another Rafal
I am not famous in old ciphers circles in any way and relatively a newcomer.
Just like Rafal Prinke I come from Poland but that's all. I know his works but he is too esotheric for me and seems to believe in it and take this stuff really seriously.
I have just discovered that to download my papers you must be logged to Academia first.
If that's a problem I make another provisionary download. I will deal with it properly later.
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. -
RE: Just a hoax?
ReneZ > 3 hours ago
(Yesterday, 01:56 PM)dashstofsk Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.[... important descriptions skipped ...]
The positional preferences together with the vertical effects and other line first word anomalies in particular show that the text cannot be a continuous narrative where words just wrap to the next line at every line break. This and all the other anomalies are going to be difficult for any natural language / shorthand / cypher hypothesist to explain.
I agree with these issues, and find them hard to explain - much harder than the low entropy issue.
If there is a real plain text behind this, some encoding method that left a degree of freedom to the encoder might go some way towards explaining it. -
RE: Just a hoax?
Jorge_Stolfi > 3 hours ago
(3 hours ago)ReneZ Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.I agree with [positional preferences together with the vertical effects and other line first word anomalies], and find them hard to explain - much harder than the low entropy issue.
But there is a You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. for the "positional preferences" and "line first word anomalies" (that in fact argues against random gibberish).
Has anyone bothered to check whether it accounts for all those claimed anomalies? There is a rather easy test outlined in that post...
All the best, --stolfi -
RE: Just a hoax?
magnesium > 3 hours ago
(3 hours ago)ReneZ Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
(Yesterday, 01:56 PM)dashstofsk Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.[... important descriptions skipped ...]
The positional preferences together with the vertical effects and other line first word anomalies in particular show that the text cannot be a continuous narrative where words just wrap to the next line at every line break. This and all the other anomalies are going to be difficult for any natural language / shorthand / cypher hypothesist to explain.
I agree with these issues, and find them hard to explain - much harder than the low entropy issue.
If there is a real plain text behind this, some encoding method that left a degree of freedom to the encoder might go some way towards explaining it.
I completely agree with Rene. To add something here, it would be more likely to see the VMS with these properties if the underlying method of text generation made it more likely for these properties to arise. If the VMS is enciphered meaningful text, for instance, then the mechanism of the underlying cipher should be capable of reliably generating the patterns we see. (The Naibbe cipher currently fails to reliably generate long-range correlations and line-position effects, for instance, so cannot be the exact text generation method.) The same is true for any other text generation proposal. -
RE: Just a hoax?
Bluetoes101 > 2 hours ago
If the ends of lines wrapped to the starts in a purposefully nonsensical way to fill up space / throw people off, that would explain it and be reproduceable to come degree.
For example if I said "this is my amazing unbreakable cipher! a=aaa b=bbb c=ccc..." then wrote,
fiaaa bbb ccc bbb ccc aab
bca bbb aaa ccc bbb ccbmc
adcc bbb aaa ccc abagb
We would know abcbcbacbbac is the actual text.