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The pragmatic nature of the script

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• The pragmatic nature of the script

• The pragmatic nature of the script

  davidjackson > 07-02-2017, 08:36 PM

  I am always amazed by the pragmatism shown in the creation of the glyphs used in the VMS.
  Medieval code glyphs tended to be elaborate. It was almost as if, when deciding to sit down and create a cipher glyph, the average cryptologist would say "the more elaborate, the more over the top and impressive, the more secret it will be".
  OK, not always. But you can divide them into two types - the functional and the ornate. The first were designed to be used, the second designed to be shown.
  
  Ornate ones are the impractical ones devised to impress. Look at the Arabian secret writing tradition; or the John Dee's Enochian.
   
  Another is the Alphabetum Kaldeorum, which was a simple 14th century cipher alphabet invented by Austrian king Rudolf IV:
     
  Rudolf is reputed to have claimed that the alphabet was from India, but this appears to have been a misdirection. It's generally assumed that Rudolf invented it (or had someone invent it for him), as he was proud enough of the system to have it engraved on his epitaph. Some have argued that the letter shapes bear a resemblance to the theoretical cipher alphabet of Aethicus Ister, a work which we know about only at third or fourth hand, but which argued for the substitution of letters in order to secure the reading of the text. It's been suggested that the work was written by the 8th century Bishop of Salzburg, St. Virgil the geometer. St. Virgil was actually an Irish missionary who travelled the continent, and who had a major falling out with St. Boniface, who twice denounced him to the Pope for heresy. Other researchers have linked Aethicus Ister to other intellectuals of the period across the whole of Eastern Europe. If so, it's perfectly possible that a copy of his work was studied by someone in Rudolf's court who appropriated his ideas for his masters new code idea.
  
  Although we appear to have no actual diplomatic correspondence written in this cipher, we do have a manuscript from 1428 which, along with some other non-European alphabets, describes the Alphabetum, (it resides at the University of Munich with the not very exciting shelf name of UB München 4° Cod. ms. 810).
  
  These codes weren't designed to blend in, or to be easy to write. They were designed with the idea of secrecy in mind, but with no attempt at ease of use. Note the AK wouldn't be easy to write - we don't have any examples of it in use, but each letter would have to be individually written carefully to avoid confusion. M and Z would be very easy to confuse, as would I and K, etc.
  
  Here's a medieval code from a You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. (you can easily see the difference between the enciphered portion and the plain text)
  
  
  They are like this because they weren't designed to encode an entire book, only phrases or even words. The idea of encoding a whole book didn't appear until literacy was high enough to warrant this; indeed, in the middle ages the word "cipher" didn't even exist. The idea was always to hide the most important, key point. In all the medieval cipher manuscripts I know of, only key words or phrases are encoded.
  
  For more pragmatic and smoother approaches, we have to wait for the Renaissance. Such as the Spanish diplomatic codes from the 16th century, which substituted abbreviations for phrases in a code book:
  
  
  That's when codes actually start becoming useful, and people realise that it's a good idea to a) be easy to write and read and b) not stand out too much.
  
  But the Voynich glyphs are different. Obviously they stand out, but they were designed from the very beginning to be easy to write and read.
  
  There is another medieval code which comes to mind, namely the number ciphers used by monks across northern France and You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.:
  
  But the notae elegantissimae described above evolved through trial and error. They weren't trying to encode the numerical details (the code was used for counting, such as items in warehouses) but trying to substitute the clumsy Roman notation in use at the time. The code vanished as soon as Arabic numerals came along.
  
  So - why did the Voynich scribe decide upon a fluid script for his book? It seems a nonsensical question to us today, but it's a completely revolutionary idea for the late middle ages. Did the script evolve? (shout out to Koen!) Or was it designed from the ground up?
  
  I suppose we'll never know, but it's fun to speculate....

• RE: The pragmatic nature of the script

  Koen G > 07-02-2017, 10:08 PM

  David, if I hadn't given you a rep point already I'd sure do so now
  
  I also like it to take a step back every once in a while and think: wait, what is this?
  
  It looks like normal, relatively fluent writing. If you hadn't been told that the script was unknown (and you're not a script expert) you wouldn't be able to tell at a glance that it may be "artificial".
  
  By coincidence I was looking through my "initial thoughts" on the VM when I had just learned about it, written somewhere in the summer of 2015. I had two "blank canvas" ideas about the script:
  
  1) The creator was a multilingual person who only mastered Latin and/or Greek script. He found that this script was not suitable to write in his second or third language, and he was not acquainted with any literary tradition in that language, only spoken. Hence he modified the script(s) he knew to make them suit his needs.
  
  OR 2) The VM script is a simplified form of a foreign script, aimed to facilitate reading for those used to Latin or Greek script.
  
  My current views are a bit more refined, but still along those lines. Because being easy to write is one thing, but for us, used to Latin script, it is also so easy to read! I wish all manuscripts were written as neatly as the VM 
  
  So basically, it might be the result of transcribing for practical reasons (expression or readability) rather than encoding for reasons of secrecy. I am certain of nothing, but the latter is low on my list of possibilities.

• RE: The pragmatic nature of the script

  davidjackson > 07-02-2017, 10:17 PM

  Well, secrecy is low on my list too, but it's the only comparison we have.

• RE: The pragmatic nature of the script

  Anton > 07-02-2017, 10:20 PM

  Natural languages also can have ornate letters, even hyeroglyphics apart. Consider, for example, the glagolithic alphabet.

• RE: The pragmatic nature of the script

  -JKP- > 07-02-2017, 10:29 PM

  (07-02-2017, 08:36 PM)davidjackson Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view....
  
  Here's a medieval code from a You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. (you can easily see the difference between the enciphered portion and the plain text)
  
  
  They are like this because they weren't designed to encode an entire book, only phrases or even words. The idea of encoding a whole book didn't appear until literacy was high enough to warrant this; indeed, in the middle ages the word "cipher" didn't even exist. The idea was always to hide the most important, key point. In all the medieval cipher manuscripts I know of, only key words or phrases are encoded.
  ...

  
  The numbering system shown in this Swedish text is very common in Nordic texts and is basically runic in concept.
  
  It's based on a logical system of trunks and branches, with the trunk "anchoring" the branches, so that the successive position of the branches denotes increasing quantities. Variations of this system exist all over Scandinavia, parts of England, and Normandy. Most of the ones I've seen have vertical trunks (like trees), but those with horizontal trunks are essentially the same idea. They were often used by tradesmen to mark bales, barrels, and other containers that have to hold certain quantities of goods and lasted as an alternate numbering system (to Roman and Arabic numericals) into fairly recent times. I think millers and possibly fishermen used it.
  
  Here you see the same nine "digits" mirrored and flipped. Sometimes the mirroring and flipping denoted larger numbers (beyond 9) and sometimes it was simply to show how the basic set looked in different orientations. In many of these systems, the higher numbers tended to be more complex because they incorporated more branches, while in some, the tens digits simply used a different shape.
  
  
  In some of these systems, the parts were elegantly combined (rather than each character drawn individually) to make composite numbers and it appears that the original design was conceived so that this could be done. This allowed large numbers to be written in less space (in a sense similar to the way Korean characters are combined except that the parts of the numbers actually touch each other to create new shapes).
  
  Most of them were not codes in the sense of hiding information, they were continuance of much older numbering systems based on those that existed before Roman and Arabic influences reached the north. They could, of course, be co-opted as cipher characters if someone wanted to, and would look inscrutable to someone not familiar with the system (especially the combined characters), but that was not their original intention.

• RE: The pragmatic nature of the script

  ReneZ > 07-02-2017, 10:29 PM

  Hi David,
  
  there's much to say about this...
  
  "Secret" alphabets were not necessarily used to hide meaning. That concept seems to have arisen in the 14th century so is of course fully relevant for the Voynch MS.
  However, apart from that, "unknown alphabets" were supposed to be a sign of learning, and knowledge.
  
  There's a piece of writing called 'Cosmographia' by someone called 'Aethicus' which is from the 8th or 9th Century. This refers to an unknown alphabet. This work seems to be another good mystery (check the net).
  
  The Alphabetum Kaldeorum already appears in the travel reports of someone called Jehan de Mandeville (before 1371) and turns out to be basically the same as the Aethicus alphabet.
  
  PS (edit): the German wikipedia entry about Aethicus rather stands out in comparison to the other languages:
  You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.

• RE: The pragmatic nature of the script

  davidjackson > 08-02-2017, 06:46 AM

  Quote:Secret" alphabets were not necessarily used to hide meaning. That concept seems to have arisen in the 14th century so is of course fully relevant for the Voynch MS.
  
  However, apart from that, "unknown alphabets" were supposed to be a sign of learning, and knowledge.

  Exactly, and I realise I left that out of my original post. This is what we see in the Arabic secret alphabets, they are essentially nonsense designed to impress.
  European ones were often based on real alphabets, but it was obvious the writers didn't have much of a clue beyond the basic notions.
  The Spanish also liked them - there was a roaring trade in nonsense charms sold for magical purposes, written in a PseudoArabic. 
  And of course, the magic charms we see across Europe that are pseudo latín or Greek.

• RE: The pragmatic nature of the script

  ReneZ > 08-02-2017, 09:07 AM

  I guess you are (also) referring to the pseudo-scripts that were popular from 1300-1500 in Western art.
  
  For this see e.g. You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. , who summarised his work in a small workshop also mentioned in the "acknowledgments" section of the Yale volume. The notion was indeed to impress, or even to create a feeling of humility in the observer, not being able to understand this.
  Unlike the fantasy work of the imaginary Aethicus, this is contemporary to the Voynich MS.
  
  It all goes to show that even some of the most obvious assumptions about the Voynich MS should not be taken for granted. It is not at all certain that the intention of the MS was to hide secrets.
  All of the following are entirely possible:
  - there is no meaning
  - the text is a trivial one, or well known from other sources
  - it refers to an imaginary "world"
  
  Of course, all examples of pseudo-scripts in paintings are very short.
  
  The earlier examples have not been much explored in the frame of the Voynich MS, at least to my knowledge.
  In the middle ages one could apparently learn the names of the people who invented all the know alphabets:
  Hebrew, Syriac, Egyptian, Greek, Roman.
  Aethicus got his name on the list too:
  You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.

• RE: The pragmatic nature of the script

  VViews > 08-02-2017, 05:00 PM

  Davidjackson,
  "So - why did the Voynich scribe decide upon a fluid script for his book?"
  This is not a nonsensical question to me, but an important one, and thank you for raising it.
  The chosen characters are not only more practical than those cipher alphabets, but also much more inconspicuous.
  The text would appear rather unremarkable to someone who was just glancing at it. This is the deceptively simple impression that many have described about the script: at first glance it looks like you could read it, until you realize you can't.
  Aside from the possibilities that you and Koen Gh have raised here, a cipher that doesn't look like one could be a cunning camouflage to minimize scrutiny. "Nothing secret/controversial here, just an herbal in a foreign language".
  
  Side note regarding the Aethicus text referenced by ReneZ. I have yet to look into this further, but the Wikipedia entries point towards some very interesting features of his writing, outside of the use of a secret alphabet.
  From the German wiki article (Google translated):
  "In places, the author shows quirky humor, such as... apparently caricaturing use of alliteration."
  More on that from the English wiki:
  "...etymological 'jokes' (e.g. using the verb 'monstrare' followed by the noun 'monstrum', then the verb 'demonstrare') and other ludic elements are found throughout."
  I find this interesting in regard to the clusters of words with only slight variations we find in the Voynich.

• RE: The pragmatic nature of the script

  ThomasCoon > 08-02-2017, 05:39 PM

  (07-02-2017, 10:20 PM)Anton Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.Natural languages also can have ornate letters, even hieroglyphics apart. Consider, for example, the glagolithic alphabet.

  
  This is true, though usually the ornate features almost inevitably get dropped. Just as in speech, people are lazy and look for shortcuts. Hieroglyphics developed into You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. and Hieratic, and I believe Cyrillic dominated Glagolithic by the 12th century.
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