The Voynich Ninja

(25-04-2022, 11:21 PM)R. Sale Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.The existence of context will serve as a check on any proposed translation

Good things come to those who wait.

(25-04-2022, 02:12 PM)Ruby Novacna Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.if they are proven to be wrong, that will allow others not to make the same mistakes

I know what you are saying, but unfortunately, things don't work this way.
The majority of people are just too lazy to read up on the matter sufficiently. (Thank God for the exceptions!!)

Then, there are quite a few people who believe that everything that has been written is best ignored anyway, for several quite interesting reasons.

In summary: just do what you enjoy doing, and no justification is needed

(26-04-2022, 01:32 AM)ReneZ Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.just do what you enjoy doing, and no justification is needed

Rene, you've managed to sum up all my thoughts in one sentence!

The key word in amateur work must be joy, the justifications will come (or not) later.

(25-04-2022, 11:56 PM)cvetkakocj@rogers.com Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.IIN in the word DAIIN can be read as one letter, or as different letters. Dr. Bax pointed out that minims in different combinations can be read as 14 different characters. 

There are sevetal arguments that point to AIIN as a unique symbol m:
m can be written is several ways, with or without the flourish start and end. That would explain the apparent differences. 
When it is decomposed in several glyphs it is difficult to read, nobody has proposed an undubted way to read them without ambiguity. There is no logic in the use of symbols with such a level of ambiguity.
The number of AIIN in the text is too high compared with any other 4-gram. The % of AIIN preceded by D compared with the non preceded by D is high. II is almost always acompanied by the starting A or ending N. 
There is an analisys that could be done by experts in handwritting.: the a, like the o, nowadays in handwritting is written counter clockwise. The m is written from the left to the right in a unique stroke. The A of the AIIN and the A in other parts of the text not included in AIIN are written in the same way? If they are not it would be an indication that AIIN is just an m.

(26-04-2022, 01:32 AM)ReneZ Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.Then, there are quite a few people who believe that everything that has been written is best ignored anyway, for several quite interesting reasons.

I must admit that I can sometimes understand these people. It is almost an art to distinguish carefully elaborated, well-founded papers from irrelevant thesis papers. It's not as if abstruse theories have no scope, and that goes for written elaborations as well. It can take a lot of time and effort to work through such papers, only to find that one is dealing with wild speculation and false conclusions. There are plenty of examples of this. Over time, a kind of "data ballast" accumulates in the mind and a kind of longing arises to deal with the VMS "from scratch", free of all kinds of theories.

(26-04-2022, 11:31 AM)Juan_Sali Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.There are several arguments that point to AIIN as a unique symbol m:

The easiest way to answer would be to choose some words containing aiin and give the different readings. Try to do this and we'll know soon enough.

(26-04-2022, 01:12 PM)Ruby Novacna Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.

(26-04-2022, 11:31 AM)Juan_Sali Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.There are several arguments that point to AIIN as a unique symbol m:

The easiest way to answer would be to choose some words containing aiin and give the different readings. Try to do this and we'll know soon enough.

I can offer you my explanation how minims work for the Slovenian language, based on the early 15th century Slovenian writing in Latin.
Because the separation of individual minims is unclear, and the space is not always reliable, some (or a lot) of knowledge of language is required to understand the words from the context. From the prefixes, suffixes, the preposition, etc. it is possible to recognize many Slovenian words, however, other transcription alphabets might generate some other words. Particularly revealing are the suffixes -am, im, -um, -dam most often indicating verbs in 1. person singular. The suffixes  -iv, iw, iiv (jiv) are characteristic for Slovenian verbs (singular, masculine, past, future tense, or conditional mood) , as well for adjectives, along with suffixes - in, an, en...
The reading of minims is difficult even for the native Slovenians, because the letters were used for different sound as they are today, and some different letters were used. The Stična Codex, created in Stična monastery by a Czeck monk, has been officially transcribed and translated by Slovenian scholars. It could give some understanding how minims were used.

(26-04-2022, 05:31 PM)cvetkakocj@rogers.com Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.

(26-04-2022, 01:12 PM)Ruby Novacna Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.

(26-04-2022, 11:31 AM)Juan_Sali Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.There are several arguments that point to AIIN as a unique symbol m:

The easiest way to answer would be to choose some words containing aiin and give the different readings. Try to do this and we'll know soon enough.

I can offer you my explanation how minims work for the Slovenian language, based on the early 15th century Slovenian writing in Latin.
Because the separation of individual minims is unclear, and the space is not always reliable, some (or a lot) of knowledge of language is required to understand the words from the context. From the prefixes, suffixes, the preposition, etc. it is possible to recognize many Slovenian words, however, other transcription alphabets might generate some other words. Particularly revealing are the suffixes -am, im, -um, -dam most often indicating verbs in 1. person singular. The suffixes  -iv, iw, iiv (jiv) are characteristic for Slovenian verbs (singular, masculine, past, future tense, or conditional mood) , as well for adjectives, along with suffixes - in, an, en...
The reading of minims is difficult even for the native Slovenians, because the letters were used for different sound as they are today, and some different letters were used. The Stična Codex, created in Stična monastery by a Czeck monk, has been officially transcribed and translated by Slovenian scholars. It could give some understanding how minims were used.

All the samples that you offer for minims are preceded by A, almost all or all the minins in the VM are preceded by A. Do you have an explanation for it? It is common is slovenian that all minins are preceded by A and only by A?.

(26-04-2022, 05:31 PM)cvetkakocj@rogers.com Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.The Stična Codex, created in Stična monastery by a Czeck monk

Thank you Cvetka! I would like to know if you quoted some of Voynich's words, I'm not sure if I understood your images correctly.

(26-04-2022, 06:48 PM)Ruby Novacna Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.

(26-04-2022, 05:31 PM)cvetkakocj@rogers.com Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.The Stična Codex, created in Stična monastery by a Czeck monk

Thank you Cvetka! I would like to know if you quoted some of Voynich's words, I'm not sure if I understood your images correctly.

The individual words on the second picture are all taken from Voynich, and the words are read and translated by me. Most of the words are still in use in dialects, but the grammatical endings are still the same in contemporary Slovenian. As you can see, the proper transcription is important for translation, and proper transcription cannot always be made from the text alone. Just try to transcribe the uncoloured part of the Stična Codex page and you will see if you get it right.
And this minims are much better than some others. Look at the minims in some German text. You would need to know some German words to read them.