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Erbario LSJ 419

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• Erbario LSJ 419

  JustAnotherTheory > 21-06-2026, 09:23 AM

  Penn Library's LJS 419 (Erbario) is an early 1400s herbal manuscript from Northern Italy. It looks like it shares many features with the VMS! These include non-existent plants, weird roots and alchemical looking herbs. 
  
  Here is a full scan on archive.org: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
  
     
  
  What do you think?

• RE: Erbario LSJ 419

  MarcoP > 21-06-2026, 09:51 AM

  The manuscript includes a copy of the Alchemical Herbal, so the usual considerations apply (similar imagery to the VMS, but apparently different plants).
  
  In an 2020 blog post, JKP discussed the simple encryption applied to some plant names:
  
  You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.

• RE: Erbario LSJ 419

  JustAnotherTheory > 21-06-2026, 10:22 AM

  (21-06-2026, 09:51 AM)MarcoP Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.In an 2020 blog post, JKP discussed the simple encryption applied to some plant names:

  
  Yes, I've read that! It's a shame that the roots and plants were not discussed more in that blog post.

• RE: Erbario LSJ 419

  Aga Tentakulus > 21-06-2026, 10:39 AM

             
  The is clear. The real Mooat onn Diamond. (Botrychium lunaria)
  That corresponds to the VM-f94r.
  You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.

• RE: Erbario LSJ 419

  Jorge_Stolfi > 21-06-2026, 12:32 PM

  (21-06-2026, 09:51 AM)MarcoP Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.In an 2020 blog post, JKP discussed the simple encryption applied to some plant names:
  You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.

  
  But if you look closely at the images (like the "Peonia") you should see that the "encryption" actually consists of vertical strokes being drawn over the original "plaintext" name in a different ink (yellower and semi-transparent).  
  
  All the best, --stolfi

• RE: Erbario LSJ 419

  Zauriek > 21-06-2026, 06:35 PM

  So, most of the plants have no text at all to describe them. If the voynich follows the same pattern, may the voynichess text of the plants were added way latter? Maybe the original Voynich manuscript did not had so many description of plants. 
  
  And pushing down this baseless-idea, could that have something to do with the 2 diferent types of sintaxis, the A and B sytles? And if that conclusion is valid, why did the voynichess changed like that in a short life spawn (assuming the added text were added before the marginalia month names) [There are so many ifs... -.- sorry.]
  
  --[Edit]
  Wait, in that logic, there is also the posibility that the empty plants were ripped off, lost or just not added to the manuscript binding.
  
  Or the Erbario LSJ 419 was not fully finished.

• RE: Erbario LSJ 419

  anyasophira > 22-06-2026, 04:57 PM

  Are we wanting to dive deeper into this particular manuscript again? I mean it hasn’t unlocked voynich over the years but I am always read to nerd out over some Alchemical herbs. While I’m here maybe I can ask the forum- I heard  of a transliteration that a scholar did  years
  Ago but I can never find the link to it. I’ve searched the catalogue  and the links to the actual manuscript. Does anyone have it ? 
  
  I love this manuscript but that cramped writing is really hard to read. 
  
  This manuscript is my lead on Brancha minor, another alchemical herb not in the main tradition , and a more realistic imagine of Herba Brancha who now gets be be Herba Brancha Major. 
  
  For more Search alchemical herbs. Marco P has a lot of good entries.  I made a thread for them. Some have proposed that Voynich might be the same
  Genre as Alchemical Herbals not enough evidence to prove this especially since we can’t read Voynich.  Lots of threads discussing a connection to Voynich. However the Alchemical Herbs are also just as hard to understand. I’ve made a thread on them. They are a good example
  Of how even being able to read the text of a manuscript can still not solve what the plants are.

• RE: Erbario LSJ 419

  JustAnotherTheory > 23-06-2026, 11:05 AM

  Can we at least agree, to some point, that the herb with the two faces in its roots, has inspired f33r? I don't recall seeing any other herbal (except the Alchemical Herbal variations), that have exactly this feature in the roots.

• RE: Erbario LSJ 419

  MarcoP > 23-06-2026, 03:17 PM

  JustAnotherTheory Wrote:Can we at least agree, to some point, that the herb with the two faces in its roots, has inspired f33r? I don't recall seeing any other herbal (except the Alchemical Herbal variations), that have exactly this feature in the roots.

  
  "Inspiration" is a subtle thing, personally I agree it is possible, maybe even likely, that there was an Alchemical Herbal influence, but parallel evolution is also possible. Human-head roots appear in other herbals, and having two of them is a simple variant.

• RE: Erbario LSJ 419

  Zauriek > 23-06-2026, 10:14 PM

  It could be fun making comparisions, why not. 
     
  (the vms pic has a chubytrunk tho)
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