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Celestial faces
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Celestial faces
R. Sale > 17-02-2025, 11:20 PM
This Post #31 reopens an interesting topic.
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Evidence so far reveals an early, Germanic use of facial features attributed to the sun. The comparison with the VMs is more problematic. While the VMs contains a number of different examples, the particular specimen chosen in the post above from f68v1 is by far the greatest outlier of the group. First, as was noted, this example is more than just a face. More than just eyes, nose and mouth. This is a head.
Examples of where a head as the sun can be found in some representations of Apollo from the Book of the Queen.
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So, there are several of these examples in the VMs where there are just celestial faces, and there are some others that look more like heads and have hair, and this one is unique because it has a headband of sorts, best called<perhaps> a fillet.
As a representation contemporary to the VMs, a good fillet is hard to find. And it seems to have a feminine preference. However, as a reference to Classical Greece, and to Helios or Apollo, it doesn't seem that out of place. -
RE: Celestial faces
Bluetoes101 > 18-02-2025, 01:38 AM
The "moon section" on f86vr also has a figure with a head band and wing/leaf/feather shaped things on side of head. It could just be hair, like on the sun example.
Anyway, my first guess was it had something to do with Hermes as the image to the left seemed to have something to do with lightning (though "lines coming from hand painted yellow" might also be anything) and I took the band to have wing-like shapes initially.
Anyway, I just remembered this that I saw back then while looking at sun/moon pool/fountain examples of the time. No band or hair unfortunately, but a full face on the crescent moon, and it just so happens to be "You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.: N7: The master, "Hermes" instructs five pupils how to make silver and gold." .. also from the right time and German. Probably nothing to do with anything, this stuff is way out of my lane but thought it ticked some boxes and can't hurt to share.
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EDIT - Ah, I thought there was a better example in here that I remembered. Moon with .. more or less a "head" and a neck scarf(?)
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EDIT 2.. It seems this image was somewhat popular, unless I just happened to find 2 in 5 manuscripts, still no suns unfortunately
The Nuremberg Chronicle (1493)
![[Image: mon.jpg]](https://i.postimg.cc/43cp9FpN/mon.jpg)
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RE: Celestial faces
R. Sale > 18-02-2025, 11:20 PM
That's definitely a face with personality, not just a generic representation. And the source is Bavarian, which goes with the other German and Austrian examples so far.
While the VMs celestial faces have a lot of variety, the best example of a face with a headband is clearly found on f67v1-2. Now forever known as "The Blue Fillet" - it clearly is the primary representation.
There are also celestial faces (f85r2-86v6) outside the cosmic pages. They are further examples of simple faces, the central sun in the "Four Seasons" and the next page with a central moon in the "Wreath of the Virgin".
The matter is more than just faces versus heads, though that is part of it. The significant factor is the clear presence of the headband - the blue fillet. Where else are celestial faces shown wearing a fillet? Examples are wanting. Do they exist? Even finding more general examples, contemporary with VMs C-14 or earlier in European sources has not been productive so far. I ended up with examples of classical statues as a potential source of influence for heads wearing a fillet - as a last resort. A direct contact with classical sources. -
RE: Celestial faces
R. Sale > 20-02-2025, 09:18 PM
Best apparent representation of a fillet - so far. Somehow helmets and fillets just don't go together. And then there are circlets and wreaths and chinstraps and crowns.
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The provenance is interesting. It is a 1410 Parisian edition of Boccaccio.
The image is the death of Leosthenes in 323 BCE. -
RE: Celestial faces
Koen G > 20-02-2025, 09:39 PM
Interesting. Wikipedia says the fillet was a sign of the unmarried woman in the Middle Ages. Do we assume the VM Sun face with the uncolored headband is a young man?
In the case of Leostenes, he was a military commander. I'm not sure what the meaning of the headband would be here. Is there anything more to it than a display of wealth or high status? -
RE: Celestial faces
Dana Scott > 21-02-2025, 04:20 AM
(20-02-2025, 09:39 PM)Koen G Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.Interesting. Wikipedia says the fillet was a sign of the unmarried woman in the Middle Ages. Do we assume the VM Sun face with the uncolored headband is a young man?
In the case of Leostenes, he was a military commander. I'm not sure what the meaning of the headband would be here. Is there anything more to it than a display of wealth or high status?
This VMs Sol has a special feature, a neck, not seen in most medieval manuscript listings. The band across the top of the head (blue) seems appropriate. A small lick of hair/sun ray at the left of the face is unique to the drawing. There appear to be folds/waves of hair on top of the head, and there may also be curls of hair around the right ear position of the head. Additional details that the artist decided to include in this rendition of the Sol. Curiouser and curiouser. Probably a woman's head as opposed to an enlightened male's expression.
Regards,
Dana Scott -
RE: Celestial faces
R. Sale > 21-02-2025, 07:57 PM
Another example of VMs artistic 'innovation'. Suns (and moons) have sometimes been given faces, but the VMs innovation, so far as nothing comparable has been found, is that faces have become heads - and not only heads, but heads with headbands. Specifically, on f67v1-2 with the big blue headband, both of these are solar heads and faces.
Regarding the headband, how is it described? The term fillet seems close. Clearly, it's not a wreath of leaves or flowers; probably not made of metal. Something like a thick ribbon made of cloth or leather. That would fit the classical depiction. In the Middle Ages, if I've got it right, the term 'fillet' was used for a style of lady's headgear on the far right, as seen in the Codex Manesse.
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Everybody has a headband of sorts, but none look like a classical fillet.
Collins Latin Dictionary has two words for 'fillet'. "Infula" is a woolen band, fillet, or 'badge of honor'. "Vitta" is a headband or 'sacrificial fillet'.
Then there is the difficulty of finding early 15th C. illustrations of anybody with a classical fillet. The primary example extant is a Parisian depiction of an historical person from the classical era. Why do the VMs solar heads have fillet headbands? Where does that image come from?
Given the classical connection of the sun with Apollo, Helios, etc., it's hard to see the sun as feminine even if the VMs illustration is 'noncommittal'. -
RE: Celestial faces
Koen G > 21-02-2025, 10:55 PM
You might want to add the Princeton Index of Medieval Art to your search repertoire. It includes the Morgan iconographic search and others. Very useful:
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You can just search for any keyword you like and see if it turns up anything for example, I've used it to quickly find a number of doctors with urine flasks. -
RE: Celestial faces
R. Sale > 25-02-2025, 09:49 PM
These examples of celestial faces are from an interesting source. Four versions of the Lauber Bible have illustrations of creation where both the sun and the moon are depicted with faces. Another connection to Lauber.
Zurich is dated c. 1431-37; Frauenfeld c. 1450. St. Gallen just says, "mid 15th" and Solothurn is c. 1460.
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St. Gallen has some stars and an elaborate, nebuly cloud band. Compared to the VMs cloud band in the central Rosette.
All these examples depict the creation. That is only one of several categories where celestial faces occur. The other religious category is the crucifixion and there were just faces put on the sun in the sky. There are also heraldic uses and certain other circumstances where celestial faces are found.
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None of these historical examples present a clear example of a solar head or face where the hair that might appear on the facial forehead is restrained by a fabric headband - which the VMs does in two places.
It's also not a common thing in what I've seen recently in art of 1400-1450 to depict a person wearing a fillet. The few examples that there are, have no relation to solar faces.
An example of an illustration with a classical fillet from the St. Gallen Bible above is on the page of 'heraldic dedication" or whatever it is. It is a whole other story - heraldry with an inverted pike entire, not to mention three escallops countercharged.
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The lady's fillet and the celestial faces are on consecutive pages 6v and 7r. Not that difficult, perhaps, to bring the two together, particularly if given a good dose of classical influences. Look what was done with the VMs cosmos. -
RE: Celestial faces
Koen G > 26-02-2025, 12:13 AM
Simple face is very common, and I think I know where it comes from. Just look for pictures of the crucifixion, where you can track the evolution from Roman style Sol and Luna torch bearers to simple faces in the sun and moon flanking the cross.
The Moon with a veil or head covering clearly made of fabric is also found, especially in German sources.
However, in 15th century manuscripts I have found not a single example of a Sun as a full head. At the very best, you get something like in one of your examples where the rays of the sun are drawn to resemble wild hair all around the face. This is still nothing like the VM examples.