[Talk] Voynich Talk Episode 1, part 1: A plant is not B plant

[Koen G]

I'm just gonna call them lobes

It's interesting that you link the central connection of the stalk to leaf shape, I hadn't thought of it that way yet but I think you are right. Another botanically driven distinction? I guess it depends on whether we think of leaf shape as a stylistic preference, which then depends on one's view on the plants. 

This leads to the next question: what do you make of typical "beta" leaves? Several fingers that appear fused at the base, then point in the same direction? These take very different forms (compare 39r, 40r, 46r...). Some of them look a bit like palm leaves fronds, but that can't explain all of them.

[Bernd]

I think we must discern 2 things - peltate leaves (with a central connection of the stalk) tend to radiate out in a more or less circular way from this connection for physiological reasons. They are either roundish or fingered. I would not know of a narrow leaf with a connection in the middle that spreads out in 2 opposite directions from that connection. Leaflets do but not singular leaves. We could however see sagittate (arrow-shaped) leaves which are quite common in the VM exhibiting this feature, but we don't.

   

The other thing are drawings in which the stalk goes inside the leaf blade like the artist wants to show the underside of the leaf. There is no reason why this should not be possible for almost all leaf shapes. But again we only see it in roundish or fingered leaves.

By the way, Currier B page You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. written by scribe 2 also has prominent leaf venation including a mid-vein!

   

[Bernd]

About typical Beta- leaves, I honestly have no idea. They almost look like a fused calyx sometimes. I can't really think of anything aside from personal preference but upon closer inspection, many Alpha-leaves aren't that different even if they are unfused at the base. You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. and You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. are pretty Beta-esque.

The pharma section actually has 4 strong fused Beta-leaves though they are too small to discern much.

   

Aside from pharma, all 'strict' Beta-style leaves are on pages by scribe 2 (f34r, f39r, f40r, f40v, f43, f46r, f55v) except one by scribe 3 which is f95r2. But scribe 5 also has one example with calyx-style leaves, f48r.

But all the leaf shapes can be found in Alpha-plants. The only thing on scribe 2 pages that stands out is that they are completely fused at the base.

   

   

   

[Koen G]

Beta leaves were one of the last features we picked up on, I believe in part due to examples like f2r. That is why being fused at the base is part of the definition. It's a subtle difference, which makes it all the more intriguing. 

Somehow I don't think I noticed the veins on 46v. They look so different, almost like a texture pattern. The mid vein is camouflaged by streaked paint. But yes, it is certainly there.
Interestingly, this is one of the few B-folios to include red, so if we had taken color into account, it would already be conflicting.

[R. Sale]

A similar use of ink and green paint.

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