14-10-2018, 04:51 PM
You're right JKP, it should certainly be included. The way the face is drawn also reminds me a lot of the VM, especially the larger faces (sun/moon etc).
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Sleeve focus thread
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14-10-2018, 09:02 PM
Fulgentis also means "one who is conspicuous", almost a Latin term for a dandy, which would possibly also fit in with the illustration.
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15-10-2018, 02:14 AM
Koen, yes, I was thinking that too about the faces.
The two you combined on the left are an especially good pair if you look at the way the end of the line on the nose curls up, a little detail not included by all illustrators. And his cheek is rouged, like the nymphs. David, thanks for that info on "fulgentius". It fits perfectly with his extra baggy sleeves and buttons (it's uncommon to see buttons explicitly added to sleeves and collars in drawings of this kind). Fancy. Member details
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15-10-2018, 11:10 AM
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15-10-2018, 03:13 PM
(15-10-2018, 11:10 AM)Koen Gh. wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.Ortenberg altarpiece, Middle Rhineland, 1420, You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. Nice catch. With so much going on in that picture, it would be easy to miss it. Member details
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16-10-2018, 08:04 AM
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16-10-2018, 10:37 AM
Interesting, I think there are some clear examples of baggy sleeves there, but 1300-1400 would make it exceptionally early. Based on the examples we've seen so far I would expect this to be 1390 at the very earliest though probably even the first decade of the 15th century. I'm on my phone so can't look up much, but I wonder if more information is available on the dating.
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18-10-2018, 05:28 PM
To stay with De' Grassi, there's also an example in the well known Casanatense Ms. 459
Historia Plantarum 1395 - 1400 Provenienza: Italia. Lombardia It's confidently dated to 1395-1400, making it a certain early example. It did take a while before I found an example in this MS, many human figures are workers. The bat-sleeved guy is paired with a monkey. Member details
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Also from Historia Plantarum, not especially baggy but maybe just enough to be included:
![[Image: 469d046601c7c2b7ed80bbd7622639c1--salomo...othing.jpg]](https://i.pinimg.com/474x/46/9d/04/469d046601c7c2b7ed80bbd7622639c1--salomone-medieval-clothing.jpg)
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