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[split] Bologna, Biblioteca Universitaria, Cod. gr. 3632
- [split] Bologna, Biblioteca Universitaria, Cod. gr. 3632
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[split] Bologna, Biblioteca Universitaria, Cod. gr. 3632
ReneZ > 23-07-2024, 03:05 AM
While looking for parallels to the Voynich MS, we must be aware that it is entirely likely that any relevant manuscripts may now be lost. Fortunately, there are also manuscripts that are not lost, but are just not very well known, either in general or to the amateur community interested in the Voynich MS.
Just speaking for myself, and to give an example, I had not heard of Bologna MS Gr. 3632 before.
I just checked Minta Collins, where it is mentioned twice, the first entry giving some interesting details.
She calls it mid-15th century, and online I saw an estimated origin of 1440. This is a bit on the late side, but still roughly contemporary with the Voynich MS. It is mainly an example of an interesting comparison, and evidence that there are still other manuscripts that have not come down to us.
It seems to have interesting parallels to Vat.Chigi F.VII 159 which set the theme of this thread, and Paris BN Grec 2108. It is, however, a compilation from many sources. There don't seem to be many illustrations online, but the few that one can find are quite interesting.Below, some herbs apparently from Dioscorides, with - I find - very interesting roots.
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RE: f18v...Dioscorides...something about those leaves
ReneZ > 23-07-2024, 03:38 AM
Here is an excerpt of Collins, p.83.
Quote:Bologna, Biblioteca Universitaria, Cod. gr. 3632 is a collection of medical and astrological
texts with crude illustrations copied from a variety of sources which Olivieri dated to the
fifteenth century. The light brown minuscule script is in a number of hands but the
illustrations are all by the same artist. There are portraits of doctors in medallions (fols 17-
26), illustrations of doctors and pupils, and of animals and snakes, together with the majority
of illustrations found in Vatican Chigi. F.VII. 159 mixed haphazardly with pictures of
bandaged legs, heads and bodies. Between folios 386-417 are crude copies of the illustrations
of plants from the Alphabetical Herbal Recension and of the prefatory illustratinos of the
Juliana Anicia Codex. The latter are dispersed out of order on several folios. On fol. 377
there is an image of Dioscorides on an X-framed stool [ ... ]
She emphasises only the herbal part, but there are zoological, magical and alchemical contents as well.
Edit: this description of the MS includes some intriguing items, like a mermaid:
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I include a brief selection of clips from images found on the internet.
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RE: f18v...Dioscorides...something about those leaves
Aga Tentakulus > 23-07-2024, 08:03 AM
Interesting, with the plants you can immediately see that there are 3 matches.
And when I saw one picture, I immediately thought of the other. -
RE: f18v...Dioscorides...something about those leaves
nablator > 23-07-2024, 11:43 AM
(23-07-2024, 03:05 AM)ReneZ Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.It seems to have interesting parallels to Vat.Chigi F.VII 159 which set the theme of this thread, and Paris BN Grec 2108. It is, however, a compilation from many sources. There don't seem to be many illustrations online, but the few that one can find are quite interesting.Below, some herbs apparently from Dioscorides, with - I find - very interesting roots.
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BU 3632
DG97EEB > Yesterday, 08:46 PM
I've searched for discussions on this and can find none
This is a wonderful 900 page compendium from Constantinople in the middle 15th century but now in Bologna.
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Description here You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
There's a glyph page (no overlap with VMS sadly)
The palette is very similar, particularly the vessels with compounds in them
It's different enough that it's not a direct source, but there's some interesting similarities as well...
The bottom middle root on that herb is particularly familiar.... -
RE: BU 3632
nablator > Yesterday, 09:41 PM
[Irrelevant after thread split] -
RE: BU 3632
DG97EEB > Yesterday, 09:47 PM
(Yesterday, 09:41 PM)nablator Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
(Yesterday, 08:46 PM)DG97EEB Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.I've searched for discussions on this and can find none
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
Merci!
I searched on Google, I searched on the advanced search... Nothing came up..
Still, it was the briefest of discussions.. I think there's more to mine here.. -
RE: [split] Bologna, Biblioteca Universitaria, Cod. gr. 3632
Koen G > 5 hours ago
I did some splitting and merging, hopefully this will be more searchable in the future.
When I first learned about this MS, one of the pages drew my attention more than others. Marco and I spent some time trying to get to the bottom of it ("trying" being the key word there), but I don't think I ever wrote about it. It's fascinating though, I'll check my notes and write something up. -
RE: [split] Bologna, Biblioteca Universitaria, Cod. gr. 3632
Koen G > 1 hour ago
It's image 840, which you have also selected as interesting. It sits somewhat lost between pages about patient manipulation as we know them from other Greek MSS (I will use "Greek" here as opposed to the Latin West).
The page uses unusual iconography from a Latin perspective. The Sun top left has a cone shape attached to it, resembling a comet or something from an eclipse diagram. But this appears to be the way this manuscript (and maybe similar MSS?) draw the sun. The way faces are drawn also feels foreign, almost modern. And by a marvelous coincidence of pattern and design, the centre of the wheel vaguely resembles the Aztec calendar - an armadillo if ever I've seen one.
That said, the scene itself feels quite Latin. Is that a wheel of Fortune? A gaping hell-maw? So what we suspect is that this may be a rare example of Latin iconography being (mis)interpreted through a Greek lens. We are more familiar with this happening the other way around.
More generally, it is clear that the illustrator of the Bologna MS isn't the best at rendering his sources faithfully. For example, there is a standard scene in Dioscorides MSS where Epinoia holds a mandragora for Dioscorides to describe and a painter to illustrate. Chigi on the left, Bologna on the right. The weirdness of this MS is already interesting for a comparison with the VM, since the art is objectively bad and debased. (Marco suggested that this may have something to do with the purpose of this MS for private use, and/or the state of the Byzantine empire in the 15th century.)
Taking in the whole page, it just doesn't make any sense. Why do almost all figures on the wheel of fortune look the same, apart from the king on top? Why is there also a king-like figure at the bottom? Why is the whole thing placed above hell? Why is it paired with Sun and Moon and four creatures and two weird faces? Is this a collage of various illustrations? Or like one of those four-way diagrams where they try to cram in as many concepts as possible?
Combining a Wheel of Fortune with a Hellmouth really makes no sense. The message of the Wheel is that fate is ever changing, and often out of your control. Fortuna turns the wheel, blindfolded, and you sit on the wheel. What goes up, must come down. Fate is merciless. The mouth of hell, on the other hand, has everything to do with morality, vice and sin. It's about how we choose to live our lives. Yes, you may be born a peasant, but you can still avoid eternal torture by leading a virtuous life. So what this image seems to convey is that a turn of Fate can condemn your soul to hell, which is the opposite of the Catholic message, and the reason why these concepts don't combine. I did find a "Wheel of the Damned" in You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view., but this is the kind of wheel they'd execute prisoners on. On each spoke, there is a tent, from which different kinds of sinners fall down.
Then there's the Sun and Moon, which adds a cosmological dimension, as well as the two faces on either side of the base (Bert and Ernie). These puzzled us for a while, but I am fairly certain the the label with the right one says "nyx", which would make them Day and Night, appropriately positioned under Sun and Moon respectively.
Again, this is hard to fit into the overall picture. Granted, there is a bright and dark side to Fortune, and she is sometimes even depicted with two faces. This is from the 14th century "Voir Dit" by Guillaume de Machaut You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. :
Quote:Nor was Fortune barred from turning
That same wheel; nor circumvented
Could her acts be, nor prevented.
Proud is she and most cruel also,
Ever perilous and false to know.
Two faces did the goddess show;
One with joy and mirth did glow,
The other by its hue made plain
The meaning of dolour and pain.
The first face shed its light on one,
For from it a great brightness shone,
While dark and black was the other,
No joy, there, could eye discover.
So one could fit in light and dark in a wheel of Fortune diagram, though I'm still not sure if this was intentional. The Sun and Day are on the side with the rising figures, which would make sense. The rising figures have a blush and they reach forward, climbing up. The sun shines upon their face. The falling figures are pale and they reach backward, trying to hold on to their former fortune.
But then there's the four creatures, placed in pairs on either side, each in a different color, the four colors available on this page: green, yellow, red and blank. Marco believes the label with the blank one reads "phlegma", so a logical conclusion would be that these are the four humors.
That's enough for general background. There are also some specifics which remind of certain parts of the VM.
There's obviously the general idea of figures moving clockwise in a circle in similar poses, the most marked ones wearing crowns. Similar stylistics as well, maybe?
But I was more surprised to see four creatures, one in each available color, right next to a hell mouth. (I will mirror the creatures to match up the colors a bit better.)
If these do indeed represent the four humors, it is hard to see how this would apply to the VM's pond creatures, so it all still feels a bit superficial. The main reason why I didn't post this before is that this folio of the Bologna MS is particularly confusing and of entirely unclear origin. So I kind of forgot about it until it was brought up again. There are still many open questions here.