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• Voynich through Phonetic Irish

• RE: Voynich through Phonetic Irish

  igajkgko > 13-11-2025, 09:33 PM

  The feeling of Déjà vu in these threads is pretty strong..
  
  I can certainly understand that you are convinced that you have (or are getting close to) a solution, and that you have spent a lot of time on it. But it's not necessarily particularly convincing to others, because we have seen more or less exactly the same before.
  
  The sentences make sense, the words make sense, they even match the pictures, it cannot be a coincidence, ..  This solution is _nothing_ like the others and that's an absolute certainty.
  
  Your last post reminded me of You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view., which was not even a month ago. And no, that thread is not the first either.
  
  Maybe you have somehow - although the odds are not on your side - managed to stumble upon the correct solution. Translating more sentences is unlikely to convince others. There's no shortage of "translations", with equally convinced authors.
  
  What's needed is to show why your solution is different. And to do that you probably need to understand where the others went wrong. Because to an observer, they look the same.

• RE: Voynich through Phonetic Irish

  Doireannjane > 13-11-2025, 09:45 PM

  (13-11-2025, 09:33 PM)igajkgko Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.The feeling of Déjà vu in these threads is pretty strong..
  
  I can certainly understand that you are convinced that you have (or are getting close to) a solution, and that you have spent a lot of time on it. But it's not necessarily particularly convincing to others, because we have seen more or less exactly the same before.
  
  The sentences make sense, the words make sense, they even match the pictures, it cannot be a coincidence, ..  This solution is _nothing_ like the others and that's an absolute certainty.
  
  Your last post reminded me of You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view., which was not even a month ago. And no, that thread is not the first either.
  
  Maybe you have somehow - although the odds are not on your side - managed to stumble upon the correct solution. Translating more sentences is unlikely to convince others. There's no shortage of "translations", with equally convinced authors.
  
  What's needed is to show why your solution is different. And to do that you probably need to understand where the others went wrong. Because to an observer, they look the same.

  
  First of all, you sent me someone who is banned and secondly, I have FAR more proof than that.

• RE: Voynich through Phonetic Irish

  oshfdk > 13-11-2025, 09:51 PM

  (13-11-2025, 08:17 PM)Doireannjane Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.So, what you're doing is not in good faith. It's rude.

  
  I can't agree. It is straightforward, yes, and it does simplify, but it's designed to highlight a point and it does a reasonably good job. Overall I see little difference between your solution and rikforto's mockup, other than yours is much more complex and evolved.
  
  

  (13-11-2025, 08:17 PM)Doireannjane Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.Can you use my methodology and see what you produce?

  
  No, even though I tried. One of the most common words in the MS is chol. According to the table you posted it's r??, only the first glyph has a single unique mapping, there is no way to identify which word this could be. Another very common word is chedy. It's r?d[in], again it's absolutely unclear what this should map to.
  
  If you wish to demonstrate your methodology, here are some of the most common words in the MS: chedy, Shedy, chol, chey, cheol, Shey, chor, dar. Each one of these appears more than a hundred times in the manuscript. If the manuscript is a phonetic representation of a language, each of these should map to some very common word. It's possible that some of them have several meanings, but at least one of the meanings should be a frequent word. What are these 8 common words, could you list them?

• RE: Voynich through Phonetic Irish

  Doireannjane > 13-11-2025, 09:51 PM

  If those statistics that person posted are right... that is mind bending though. I have far more than 7 consecutive pages.

• RE: Voynich through Phonetic Irish

  Doireannjane > 13-11-2025, 10:09 PM

  (13-11-2025, 09:51 PM)oshfdk Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.

  (13-11-2025, 08:17 PM)Doireannjane Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.So, what you're doing is not in good faith. It's rude.

  
  I can't agree. It is straightforward, yes, and it does simplify, but it's designed to highlight a point and it does a reasonably good job. Overall I see little difference between your solution and rikforto's mockup, other than yours is much more complex and evolved.
  
  

  (13-11-2025, 08:17 PM)Doireannjane Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.Can you use my methodology and see what you produce?

  
  No, even though I tried. One of the most common words in the MS is chol. According to the table you posted it's r??, only the first glyph has a single unique mapping, there is no way to identify which word this could be. Another very common word is chedy. It's r?d[in], again it's absolutely unclear what this should map to.
  
  If you wish to demonstrate your methodology, here are some of the most common words in the MS: chedy, Shedy, chol, chey, cheol, Shey, chor, dar. Each one of these appears more than a hundred times in the manuscript. If the manuscript is a phonetic representation of a language, each of these should map to some very common word. It's possible that some of them have several meanings, but at least one of the meanings should be a frequent word. What are these 8 common words, could you list them?

  
  If you're not going to try to demonstrate repeatability, why are you on this thread? That's the point of the thread, it's in my initial post. What you write above is incorrect already. According to what I've written and posted on three different platforms, those characters would read: R, A, FADA
  rá1, m. (gs. as s. ~, as vn. ~ite; pl. ~ite). 1. vn. of ABAIR1. 2. Saying, utterance. ~ Bhearcháin, Bearchan’s saying, prophecy.

• RE: Voynich through Phonetic Irish

  Doireannjane > 13-11-2025, 10:17 PM

  Here are the rest in order leaving out the last two:
  
  
  form of
  rith2, v.t. & i. (vn. ~, pp. rite). Run. 1. (a)~ i rás, to run in a race.
  
  
  bréidín1, m. (gs. ~, pl. ~í). 1. Dim. of BRÉID1. 2. Homespun cloth; tweed. ~ bán, white homespun. 3. Kerchief. 4. (pl.) Gossamer. 5. Layer.
  bréidín2, m = BRÉITSÍN.
  
  rinn1, f. (gs. ~e, npl. reanna, gpl. reann). 1. Point, tip. ~ sleá, claímh, point of spear, of sword. ~ saighde, arrow-head. S.a. 6. ~ triantáin, vertex of triangle. ~ bachaille, tip of staff. Tá sé i ~ aon mhéire aige, he has it at his finger-tips. 2. Top, apex; culmination. Ó ~ go sáil, from head to heel. I ~ an choimheascair, at the height of the struggle. I ~ a oirircis, at the peak of his renown. 3. ~ (tíre), point of land, cape, promontory. Na reanna liatha, the grey headlands. 4. Pointed weapon; sharp-pointed instrument. Reanna agus faobhair, pointed and bladed weapons, spears and swords. Trí ~ agus fhaobhar, ‘by point and edge,’ by force of arms. Bás de ~, death by the sword. 5. Fig: Tá ~ ar an lá, the day is piercingly cold. Tháinig ~ ar a shúile liom, he looked daggers at me. 6. Bot: ~ roisc, eyebright. ~ dhearg, red-hot poker. ~ saighde, arrowhead. 7. Pros: Last word of verse-line. ~ agus airdrinn, stressed syllable at end of line rhyming with unstressed syllable of longer word at end of following line.
  rinn2, m. (gs. & npl. reanna, gpl. reann). Star, planet. Na reanna neimhe, the heavenly, celestial, bodies.
  rinn3 = rinne : DÉAN2.
  rinn4 = linn : LE1.
  
  
  rá1, m. (gs. as s. ~, as vn. ~ite; pl. ~ite). 1. vn. of ABAIR1. 2. Saying, utterance. ~ Bhearcháin, Bearchan’s saying, prophecy.
  
  
  reann1. 1. gpl. of RINN2. 2. m = RINN2.
  reann2 : RINN1.
  
  
  
  WITH A FADA IS SUFFIX MENANING "FROM"
  ré1, f. (gs. ~, pl. ~anna). 1. Moon. (a) An ~ agus na réaltaí, the moon and the stars. (b) Phase of moon. ~ nua, new moon. An ~ ghealaí, an ~ sholais, the visible moon, moonlight. Oíche ~ gealaí, bright moonlight night. An ~ dhorcha, the dark of the moon, the dark. Oíche ~ dorcha, moonless night; very dark night. Lán na ~, the full moon. © Uair sa ~, once a month; once in a while. Gach ~ sholais, regularly; at every opportunity. 2. Period. (a) Portion of time. Lit: ~ mhór den lá, a great part of the day. Leis an ~ sin, during that time. S.a. AITHRÍ 2. (b) Span of life, of career. Is fada an ~ a fuair sé, he had a long life. Chaith sé a ~ leis, he spent his life at it. I ~ Iorua, in the time of Herod. Le mo ~, during my lifetime; as long as I live. © Age, era. An Ré Órga, the Golden Age. ~ na Críostaíochta, the Christian era. (d) (In phrase) Roimh ~, in advance, beforehand. Bhí mé ann roimh ~, I was there beforehand. An oíche roimh ~, the previous night. 3. Lit: Space, intervening distance. An ~ ó thalamh go firmimint, the distance between earth and sky. (Var: m)
  ré2, f. (gs. ~, pl. ~ite). Stretch of ground; level ground. ~ shléibhe, stretch of moorland. ~ rosaigh, stretch of woodland; bushy ground. Fig: Tá an áit ina ~ rosaigh, the place is in a chaotic state. Lit: ~ charbaid, chariot-course. ~ chatha, chomhraic, battle-ground.
  ré3, m. (gs. ~, pl. ~anna). Agr: Row.
  ré4, m. (gs. ~, pl. ~anna). Mus: Re.
  ré5, s. (In phrase) Don ~ (braon, pingin), not a, devil a (drop, penny).
  ré6-, pref. Level, smooth; easy; fairly, moderately.
  ré7. s. (In phrase) ~ roithleagán, dizziness. ~ roithleagánach, dizzy, causing dizziness.
  ré8 = ROIMH.

• RE: Voynich through Phonetic Irish

  Doireannjane > 13-11-2025, 10:25 PM

  RAG
  
  ráig, f. (gs. ~e, pl. ~eanna). Sudden rush; sudden outbreak; fit, bout, attack. ~ a thabhairt amach, to dash out, to sally forth. ~ reatha, sudden spurt. ~ ruathair, mad rush. ~ feirge, fit of anger. Tháinig ~ air, he flew into a rage. ~ thinnis, bout of illness. ~ bhruitíní, outbreak of measles. ~ bháistí, ~ de mhúr, sudden shower. De ~, suddenly, hurriedly, with a rush. (Var:raig)
  
  ***In some sections more linked to this: 
  rad1, f. (gs. raide). 1 = RADADH. 2. (In phrase) Cead raide, leave to do as one pleases. Tabhair cead raide do na páistí, let the children amuse themselves. Tá cead raide acu ar na milseáin, they may take all the sweets they like.
  
  rad2, v.t. & i. 1. Lit: Give, bestow. (Usually preterite) ~ sé ór dóibh, he gave them gold. ~adh luach a deor di, she was rewarded for her tears. 2. Throw, cast, fling. Clocha a ~adh le rud, to cast stones at sth. Bhí sé ag ~adh ceisteanna chugam, he was plying me with questions. Ag ~adh dorn, throwing punches. Ag ~adh báistí, pouring rain. Ag ~adh cainte, talking rapidly, volubly. ~sé é féin isteach san uisce, he flung himself into the water. 3. (Of horse, etc.) Fling, kick. Ag ~adh lena chosa deiridh, flinging out his hind legs. ~fadh sé thú, he would throw you. B’fhéidir go ~fadh an t-asal leat, the donkey might lash out at you. 4. Caper, frolic, gambol. Ag ~adh is ag léimneach, frisking and jumping.
  
  
  and DOCH (has alternatives and is more context dependent)
  
  
  deoch1, f. (gs. dí, pl. ~anna). 1. Drink; draught, potion. ~ a ól, to take a drink. ~ a thabhairt do dhuine, to give s.o. a drink. ~ uisce, bhainne, leanna, drink of water, of milk, of ale. ~ mheisciúil, intoxicating drink. ~ leighis, healing potion. ~ shláinte, pick-me-up. ~ chodlata, ~ shuain, sleeping-draught. ~ dhearmaid, (mythical) drink of forgetfulness. ~ an dorais, stirrup-cup. D’aon ~, at a draught. ~ a ól ar dhuine, to drink a toast to s.o. Ól na dí seirbhe a thabhairt ar rud, to face up to an unpleasant situation, to get a disagreeable task over and done with. Lucht dí, drinkers. Prov: Is túisce ~ ná scéal, one should offer a drink before asking for news. Ar ~, in one’s cups. 2. Quantity of liquid; infusion, wash. ~ a chur faoi rud, to immerse sth.; to cover sth. with colouring or washing liquid. ~ óir a chur faoi mhiotal, to wash a metal with gold. Chuir sí ~ den chorcair faoin éadach, she immersed the cloth in purple dye. Nuair a fuair na fréamhacha trí dheoch den Aibreán, when three April showers had infused the roots. (Var: npl. ~a, gpl. ~)
  
  deoch2, v.t. 1. Immerse, cover with liquid. 2. (In phrase) Ag ~adh agus ag pógadh a chéile, smothering each other with kisses.

• RE: Voynich through Phonetic Irish

  Doireannjane > 13-11-2025, 10:32 PM

  All you need is Teanglann

• RE: Voynich through Phonetic Irish

  Mauro > 13-11-2025, 10:37 PM

  (13-11-2025, 10:32 PM)Doireannjane Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.All you need is Teanglann

  
  And some 'creativity'.

• RE: Voynich through Phonetic Irish

  oshfdk > 13-11-2025, 10:44 PM

  (13-11-2025, 10:09 PM)Doireannjane Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.If you're not going to try to demonstrate repeatability, why are you on this thread?

  
  Good question actually. Mostly because I strongly believe that even the most unrealistic solutions may contain useful insights, when coming from a person that seems to be genuinely interested in the manuscript and has obviously spent considerable time working on it. So, I generally engage with many new solutions, even when I find them completely implausible. Also, you did ask for a review of your approach in your first post. If your only desire in this thread is for people to demonstrate repeatability by blindly applying your method, then there is definitely no need for me to spend more time here.
  
  

  (13-11-2025, 10:09 PM)Doireannjane Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.All you need is Teanglann

  
  The words you provided are very unrealistic for the most common words in almost any text in any language. The most common words even in a technical or poetic text would be generic words like: and, not, which, that, even, for, this, from, very, often, less, more, each, what, there, get, take, etc. Not "saying", "point", "cloth", etc.
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