Anton > 23-05-2021, 08:36 PM
(23-05-2021, 06:23 PM)geoffreycaveney Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.Just a general comment about the choice between the meaning of "pox (leber) ..." as (1) a curse, or (2) a simple record of an exchange: I would rather expect a curse in such a significant place as the only few lines of text on the final page of a large manuscript, parts of which (the few lines) are enciphered in two different cipher systems. It would seem to be a strange place to record the amount of money that goat liver cost.
Searcher > 23-05-2021, 08:51 PM
Aga Tentakulus > 24-05-2021, 01:51 AM
-JKP- > 24-05-2021, 02:44 AM
(23-05-2021, 05:35 PM)Anton Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.If we admit that "p" in "pbren" may stand for an abbreviation, it makes sense to consider that "P" in "pmen" and "pfer" may be an abbreviation too. Otherwise the "pf" bigram is difficult to fit into the context indeed. The foremost option that ever came to my mind was "pferd" (horse), but unfortunately there's not the slightest trace of "d" after "r".
Aga Tentakulus > 24-05-2021, 03:18 AM
MarcoP > 26-06-2021, 11:50 AM
Koen G > 26-06-2021, 01:11 PM
(27-04-2016, 05:43 AM)ReneZ Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.I remember one interpretation, but not sure by whom, where 'ahia' was considered to mean (h)agia i.e. Greek for holy or saint. What I don't remember is whether use of ahia in this sense was attested elsewhere. That is of course important.
Searcher > 26-06-2021, 02:30 PM
(26-06-2021, 01:11 PM)Koen G Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.Greek for "Holy Mary" is, according to the wiki list linked above Ἁγία Μαρία. This is so close to the VM's "ahia maria" that I'm starting to wonder why it is not yet generally accepted as the most likely reading.I am also really surprised with this. In the You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. I wrote:
Quote:What if the second line is a mix only of two languages: Latin and Greek (in Latin transliteration)?And from my You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.:
ανχητον όλα dabas μίλτος τε τάρ tere portas
I just think that όλα is not a correct form of the word, possibly, sribe's mistake. So, perhaps, it must be:
ανχητον όλο dabas μίλτος τε τάρ tere portas
(you added all anchiton, ochres, and so, rub gates [...])
Quote:I looked through the thread quickly and payd attention to ReneZ's post where he wrote that someone supposed that the word "ahia" may mean "hagia". In the light of my later examination, it is one more evidence that the scribe uses Latin transliteration of some Greek words. "αγια Μαρια" is really common Greek word combination, an analogue of "Saint Mary". The scribe just uses not usual transliteration "agios", "agia", but changes "g" with "h".And no one seems to be interest in the latter. I understand that this thread have became too long and the information gets lost in this big data. So, probably, I was to summarize these two posts, to accent on that that the two lines of the marginalia can contain 6 Greek words among the rest text (Latin and magic words). In this case, these two lines becomes absolutely readable and comprehensible, besides, of course, the magic words. I think the mix of the two languages and transliteration of the Greek words into Latin are intentional, to obscure the meaning of the text, to make it look more magic for a pacient.
MarcoP > 26-06-2021, 02:37 PM
(26-06-2021, 01:11 PM)Koen G Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.But I noticed the word before "maria" in the VM could be Greek as well. Apparently this was addressed before in this thread, though it didn't gain much traction.
(27-04-2016, 05:43 AM)ReneZ Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.I remember one interpretation, but not sure by whom, where 'ahia' was considered to mean (h)agia i.e. Greek for holy or saint. What I don't remember is whether use of ahia in this sense was attested elsewhere. That is of course important.
Greek for "Holy Mary" is, according to the wiki list linked above Ἁγία Μαρία. This is so close to the VM's "ahia maria" that I'm starting to wonder why it is not yet generally accepted as the most likely reading.
Anton > 26-06-2021, 03:23 PM