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More cleartext in the MS?
- More cleartext in the MS?
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RE: More cleartext in the MS?
davidjackson > 22-01-2020, 03:49 PM
It could be something like this vord (same page, top right, second line)
![[Image: image.jpg?q=f68v2_3-1050-129-55-27]](https://voynich.ninja/extractor/image.jpg?q=f68v2_3-1050-129-55-27)
For whatever reason the scribe cocked up the first letter (the stroke went round the wrong way), possibly due to the angle of writing, and he blobbed the rest of the word. -
RE: More cleartext in the MS?
Koen G > 22-01-2020, 03:50 PM
Anton, I'm pretty sure its two words, possibly three. The preceding A and maybe the word before that as well.
Voynichese.com acts weird on my phone. How often does isolated A appear in the MS? -
RE: More cleartext in the MS?
-JKP- > 22-01-2020, 04:18 PM
(22-01-2020, 03:49 PM)davidjackson Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.It could be something like this vord (same page, top right, second line)
For whatever reason the scribe cocked up the first letter (the stroke went round the wrong way), possibly due to the angle of writing, and he blobbed the rest of the word.
That looks like a normal VMS vord to me: oram
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RE: More cleartext in the MS?
Anton > 22-01-2020, 04:37 PM
(22-01-2020, 03:50 PM)Koen G Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.Anton, I'm pretty sure its two words, possibly three. The preceding A and maybe the word before that as well.
I read those as chio y (possibly cheo y)
You will find that same position in the lunar circle in the top also reads chio -
RE: More cleartext in the MS?
Anton > 22-01-2020, 04:46 PM
@-JKP-
How would you read the token in f68r1, lunar circle, at one o'clock? -
RE: More cleartext in the MS?
Helmut Winkler > 22-01-2020, 04:58 PM
As I said, I think it is cleartext and I think it is an indication tha the ms. is not encrypted -
RE: More cleartext in the MS?
Wladimir D > 22-01-2020, 06:26 PM
This example has been precisely discussed twice already. This poker "s / f" is present in several places. It is especially interesting that it is found on the next page f 68r1.
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RE: More cleartext in the MS?
davidjackson > 22-01-2020, 06:55 PM
(22-01-2020, 04:18 PM)-JKP- Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.That looks like a normal VMS vord to me: oram
I meant, the "plaintext" word under discussion could be a badly inked word similar to this one - an o before he drew the r the wrong way round and blobbed the rest. -
RE: More cleartext in the MS?
-JKP- > 22-01-2020, 11:39 PM
davidjackson Wrote:I meant, the "plaintext" word under discussion could be a badly inked word similar to this one - an o before he drew the r the wrong way round and blobbed the rest.
Sorry, David, you will have to show me. There are no letters in that token that look like Voynich glyphs. It's not just the first part that is unusual. It doesn't look like Arabic or Greek or Glagolitic either. The closest thing I can see, although I am not sure that is what is intended, is Latin characters.
Not a single one of the glyphs looks like a VMS glyph. None of them look like reversed letters either (I can't see anything that looks like a reversed Voynich r and the last char has a different stroke order, slant, and shape from a normal d). So if there are no Voynich glyphs, how can it be "similar to" oram?
...
This one that Wladimir posted on the other side is different in that four Voynich glyphs can be distinguished. The only one in doubt is between t and ear. So we have t*ear. It's possible the little hook on the bottom right of the t is another e, in which case the mangled glyph might be the left part of a badly drawn sh with that thing at the top being the cap. The sh was sometimes drawn strangely and with strokes in different orders, although it's not usually that angular.
So, the example below DIFFERS from the above example in that there is only one messy part, the rest is readable as Voynich glyphs. In contrast, the example that René posted has no shapes that look like Voynich glyphs:
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RE: More cleartext in the MS?
Koen G > 23-01-2020, 12:01 AM
(22-01-2020, 04:37 PM)Anton Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.You will find that same position in the lunar circle in the top also reads chio
Okay, I understand better where you are coming from. In the other circle, the text becomes weird at the same angle. Maybe the scribe did not find it necessary to rotate the page for this (possible to reach with right hand writing) and therefore produced slanted / deformed glyphs.
Still, like JKP I have a hard time seeing any Voynichese in this. If it is cleartext, it was placed in a difficult location.