MarcoP > 30-10-2019, 10:15 PM
(30-10-2019, 09:03 PM)Koen G Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.(30-10-2019, 08:13 PM)ReneZ Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.That's quite remarkable: the encoded Macchiavelli is almost identical in behaviour with the Voynich text.
Indeed, at least in these per page statistics. This probably means that Voynichese vocabulary alone is enough to account for the high frequencies of small edit distance?
Koen G > 30-10-2019, 10:35 PM
ReneZ > 31-10-2019, 06:22 AM
Quote:For instance, in the VMS, 87% of words have a distance from a previous word in the same page that is smaller than 3. Is this value enough to confirm Timm's theory?
Torsten > 31-10-2019, 04:55 PM
(30-10-2019, 10:15 PM)MarcoP Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.Since the mapping matched word frequencies in the two texts (Machiavelli and VMS) we basically imported the VMS network of similar words into Machiavelli, which already started with a very similar TTR. For instance, one of the properties mentioned by Torsten is that in Voynichese word types that occur frequently also have the highest number of similar word-types: this mapping makes so that the encoded Machiavelli shares this property.
(30-10-2019, 08:33 AM)MarcoP Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.Could shapchedyfeey in You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. result from sho.pcheey.pchey in f8r?
MarcoP > 31-10-2019, 05:41 PM
Quote:pliny_mod2 is interesting, because due to its structure it allows to predict the frequencies of the various edit distances. For all words that are not the same (edit distance 0) the ratio should be 20 : 5 : 1 for edit distances 1 , 2 , 3 , and smaller again for 4.
ReneZ > 02-11-2019, 08:55 AM
(31-10-2019, 05:41 PM)MarcoP Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.I think that the results for mod1 and mod2 tell us more than the encryption of Machiavelli: your two methods autonomously generate a network of similar words, as Timm's method does.
You wrote:
Quote:pliny_mod2 is interesting, because due to its structure it allows to predict the frequencies of the various edit distances. For all words that are not the same (edit distance 0) the ratio should be 20 : 5 : 1 for edit distances 1 , 2 , 3 , and smaller again for 4.
This seems a promising approach. I was thinking that it might be the case to apply the method to Machiavelli (or to a different text with a more Voynich-like TTR than Pliny), but I believe these ratios are not optimal. The histogram for Voynichese looks more like 15:10:5. I wonder how difficult it would be to tune the method to get results closer to Voynichese?
MarcoP > 02-11-2019, 04:49 PM
(31-10-2019, 06:22 AM)ReneZ Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.This method says that all first lines of paragraphs are not copied from the same page but from previous first lines of paragraphs. That means that these lines should not be searched for matching previous words, but should be searched as sources for matching words from later text on the same page.
On average, there are probably more than 13% of words on first lines, keeping in mind that the average paragraph length is strongly affected by the short paragraphs in quire 20.
This would be a more complicated test. For the modified Macchiavelly text this is a meaningless point.
However, we can still learn more. In the modified Macchiavelli, the page breaks are arbitrary. The text is not page-oriented and in any case the page breaks were introduced arbitrarily.
So, one can predict that the minimum edit distance will vary over each page as follows:
Since the appearance of similar words is purely a matter of chance, near the top of each page the average will be higher, since there are simply fewer words to compare with. As one goes down the page, the average will decrease as there are more and more words to compare with.
This would be the typical behaviour of a text that was not created using auto-copying.
For a text that was created using auto-copying, such a trend should not exist, and the minimum edit distance should be much more equal over each page.
In fact, if this could be visualised (e.g. using colour-coded words), one should see a more or less constant behaviour over the text, except the first lines of paragraphs which should be higher as the words were also taken from earlier pages.
ReneZ > 02-11-2019, 08:26 PM
Torsten > 04-11-2019, 01:11 AM
Koen G > 04-11-2019, 10:14 AM