bi3mw > 14-04-2019, 10:11 PM
Koen G > 14-04-2019, 11:09 PM
geoffreycaveney > 14-04-2019, 11:13 PM
(14-04-2019, 11:09 PM)Koen G Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.Interesting, JKP. Did you respect word boundaries?
So one null is your main deviation from one-to-one? I suspect o is a likely candidate because you can use it for padding, breaking up illegal clusters.
-JKP- > 15-04-2019, 06:08 AM
(14-04-2019, 11:09 PM)Koen G Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.Interesting, JKP. Did you respect word boundaries?
So one null is your main deviation from one-to-one? I suspect o is a likely candidate because you can use it for padding, breaking up illegal clusters.
geoffreycaveney > 15-04-2019, 12:13 PM
(15-04-2019, 06:08 AM)-JKP- Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.(14-04-2019, 11:09 PM)Koen G Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.Interesting, JKP. Did you respect word boundaries?
So one null is your main deviation from one-to-one? I suspect o is a likely candidate because you can use it for padding, breaking up illegal clusters.
Yes, one null is my main deviation. There is also one that might be a slight fudge, but not too much (there is a rationale behind it).
I really don't think of Voynich units as words. I never have. I think of them as tokens. If the VMS is a cipher, then token-length frequently does not mean word-length. Plus nulls are frequent in ciphers, including medieval ciphers.
I don't know if Voynichese is a cipher. Strange-looking shapes can mean a lot of things (numbers, sounds, etc.) and might be for convenience rather than to hide things (as in the alphabets the missionaries invented to try to express sounds from another language). But it might be a cipher, in which case tokens/blocks/units (or whatever you are comfortable calling them) and words are not necessarily synonymous.
-JKP- > 15-04-2019, 12:16 PM
(15-04-2019, 12:13 PM)geoffreycaveney Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view....
This exercise is an excellent reminder that even a standard "Sunday paper cryptogram puzzle" with one-to-one substitution can be difficult and challenging, when (1) you don't know which language it is written in, (2) even if you think you have guessed the language correctly, you are not a native speaker of it, and (3) word breaks in the cryptogram may not match word breaks in the text of the underlying language.
Geoffrey
geoffreycaveney > 15-04-2019, 02:25 PM
(15-04-2019, 12:16 PM)-JKP- Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.(15-04-2019, 12:13 PM)geoffreycaveney Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view....
This exercise is an excellent reminder that even a standard "Sunday paper cryptogram puzzle" with one-to-one substitution can be difficult and challenging, when (1) you don't know which language it is written in, (2) even if you think you have guessed the language correctly, you are not a native speaker of it, and (3) word breaks in the cryptogram may not match word breaks in the text of the underlying language.
Geoffrey
Yes, I agree with these points. And I really had to learn firsthand how MUCH of an obstacle it can be to not know the underlying language. I'll wait a few days before posting the answer so people have a chance to give it some brain cycles.
-JKP- > 15-04-2019, 03:36 PM
(15-04-2019, 02:25 PM)geoffreycaveney Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view....
To have any hope of solving this, I'm going to have to ask for a clarification on the consistency of the character [a] in this cipher:
In the cipher text [a] appears 11 times as part of [ain], 9 times as part of [aiin] (including the endings of all 4 lines!), and 8 times elsewhere without [(i)in] following it.
...
geoffreycaveney > 15-04-2019, 03:37 PM
(15-04-2019, 03:36 PM)-JKP- Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.(15-04-2019, 02:25 PM)geoffreycaveney Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view....
To have any hope of solving this, I'm going to have to ask for a clarification on the consistency of the character [a] in this cipher:
In the cipher text [a] appears 11 times as part of [ain], 9 times as part of [aiin] (including the endings of all 4 lines!), and 8 times elsewhere without [(i)in] following it.
...
I'm not sure how to answer this without giving too much away. The prevalence of "a" is a linguistic reality in some languages.
geoffreycaveney > 17-04-2019, 03:53 PM