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[Trinity] Questions about Trinity MS script
- [Trinity] Questions about Trinity MS script
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[Trinity] Questions about Trinity MS script
Koen G > 03-05-2017, 09:50 AM
I've got some questions about the script:
- Does r sometimes look like 2 depending on the following vowel? And can this same 2 in isolation be used to mean "and"?
- When this "2" is merged with a "4", what does that mean?
- Does a superscript "u" just mean I have to insert it? For example "2 qtanarus" with a "u" on top of the q.
- I take it that a "9" as the end of a word is a generic ending marker. Is it correct that in the names of plants we can't really be sure what this is? For example, a "Greek" name for a plant is "lamb9". This could be lambis, lambus, lambos, lambes...? -
RE: Trinity College MS O.2.48 Apuleii Herbarium
-JKP- > 03-05-2017, 10:08 AM
(03-05-2017, 09:50 AM)Koen Gh. Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.I've got some questions about the script:
- Does r sometimes look like 2 depending on the following vowel? And can this same 2 in isolation be used to mean "and"?
- When this "2" is merged with a "4", what does that mean?
- Does a superscript "u" just mean I have to insert it? For example "2 qtanarus" with a "u" on top of the q.
- I take it that a "9" as the end of a word is a generic ending marker. Is it correct that in the names of plants we can't really be sure what this is? For example, a "Greek" name for a plant is "lamb9". This could be lambis, lambus, lambos, lambes...?
Usually the "2" stands for "ur" or "tur" but it sometimes also stands for "et" which means it can be "et" (and) when it stands alone, or the syllable "et" when it is attached to other words. In this document (at least the parts I've read so far) it seems to be consistently used as "et".
2 merged with a 4 is usually something like "etrum" but it can also be "etem". It depends on context (and whether it's merged with other letters). It is occasionally "etis" but usually the "tis" abbreviation is used for that (it looks like EVA-j), rather than the "4" character.
Yes, the superscripted "u" (sometimes it's written like a colon) is usually a "u" after q.
Most of the time the 9 is con- com at the beginning and -cum/-um or -cus/-us at the end but yes, it is generic enough that it sometimes stands for other related endings. If a Greek names are sprinkled in, it is often -os.
The character that looks like a "z" has several meanings also. It can be -um, -em, -orum, -bus, or sometimes even just "m". -
RE: Trinity College MS O.2.48 Apuleii Herbarium
Koen G > 03-05-2017, 10:14 AM
Thanks, JKP! That's clear.
Now that we're on the subject, what on earth is going on in words like this?
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RE: Trinity College MS O.2.48 Apuleii Herbarium
MarcoP > 03-05-2017, 10:34 AM
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RE: [split] Questions about Trinity MS script
Koen G > 03-05-2017, 03:29 PM
I just split this into a separate thread so I (or anyone else) can ask questions here and people can choose whether they check it or not
The problem with these plant names is that they sometimes look like random groups of letters, which makes it hard to know what they should be. Also, sometimes weird capitals in the beginning. What would you make of this? Draon? Raraon?
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RE: [split] Questions about Trinity MS script
MarcoP > 03-05-2017, 05:13 PM
(03-05-2017, 03:29 PM)Koen Gh. Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.I just split this into a separate thread so I (or anyone else) can ask questions here and people can choose whether they check it or not
The problem with these plant names is that they sometimes look like random groups of letters, which makes it hard to know what they should be. Also, sometimes weird capitals in the beginning. What would you make of this? Draon? Raraon?
Many of these abbreviations are ambiguous. A missing “r” sometimes looks like a superscript “u”.
The last words of the fist line of the attachment (You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.) are “folia lata q[ua]drata” (large squared leaves).
The last line reads:
“flos rub[e]a for[r]ma[ta] i[n] mod[o] ca[r]diu” (a red flower shaped like thistle's)
My impression is that plant names are usually not abbreviated. The one you posted above looks like Draon or Dicaon to me. Typically, they are easier to read than that
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RE: [split] Questions about Trinity MS script
ReneZ > 04-05-2017, 11:33 AM
As far as I can tell, the entire MS (apart from obvious later additions) is in one hand.
I would welcome views on that.
The library description says: 26 lines to a page, but this rule does not apply throughout the MS.
it seems to have been written 'free hand' and the number of lines per page varies.
One odd thing is the use, also throughout the MS, of thin lines above the text that look like acute accents.
It is intentional, and used both in the main text (brown ink) and in the highlighted parts (red ink).
I am really curious if anyone has an explanation for that. -
RE: [split] Questions about Trinity MS script
MarcoP > 04-05-2017, 12:21 PM
(04-05-2017, 11:33 AM)ReneZ Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.As far as I can tell, the entire MS (apart from obvious later additions) is in one hand.
I would welcome views on that.
The library description says: 26 lines to a page, but this rule does not apply throughout the MS.
it seems to have been written 'free hand' and the number of lines per page varies.
One odd thing is the use, also throughout the MS, of thin lines above the text that look like acute accents.
It is intentional, and used both in the main text (brown ink) and in the highlighted parts (red ink).
I am really curious if anyone has an explanation for that.
Hello Rene,
I agree that the ms seems to be written in a single hand. It seems to me that two different painting styles appear in the illustrations (most are light and water-color like, but some are darker and duller). The ink drawings seem to be in a single hand, though.
Could you please attach an example of the "acute accents" lines? I don't think I noticed them... -
RE: [split] Questions about Trinity MS script
ReneZ > 04-05-2017, 02:45 PM
(04-05-2017, 12:21 PM)MarcoP Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.Could you please attach an example of the "acute accents" lines? I don't think I noticed them...
Here's a sample from f36v.
It looks as if these are the 'dots' on the i.
In some places this does not seem to fit.... -
RE: [split] Questions about Trinity MS script
Koen G > 04-05-2017, 02:54 PM
I have thought the same. But it seems that sometimes the dots float off very far from the i.