A key to understand the VMS
#47
Quote:Sam G Wrote:
Well I still don't see why not, even in poetry, and you ignored the (basically more important) suggestions that it could be due to reduplication or agreement.

First of all that the VMS contains language is your hypothesis. Therefore it is on you to demonstrate that all the features of the VMS can be explained by this hypothesis.

My arguments against a language are that in natural languages a word normally is used because of its meaning and not because it is similar to a previously written one. Another reason is that ALL words in the VMS are similar to each other. A third reason is that the text considers the format of the page. For instance words ending in -m are typical for the end of a line. Words at the beginning of a paragraph start typically with a gallow glyph and gallow glyphs are more common in the first line of a paragraph. The first word in a line is on average longer then the other words in a line.

Quote:Sam G Wrote:[url=https://www.voynich.ninja/post-10626.html#pid10626][/url]
(01-01-2017, 08:14 PM)Torsten Wrote: wrote:For the most frequently used word daiin it is possible to build a tree of similar words starting with o- or qo-. The frequencies for this words are very characteristic:

Level 1:                                          daiin (863 times)

Level 2:          okaiin (212 times)         |          otaiin (154)        |  odaiin (60)
Level 3: qokaiin (262 times), kaiin (65) | qotaiin ( 79), taiin (42) | qodaiin (42)
There are more words starting with ok- or ot- then with od- and the word starting with qok- is even more frequent then the word starting with ok.

So qokaiin is more common than okaiin, but otaiin is more common than qotaiin.  Why should this be true, from the standpoint of your auto-copying hypothesis?  If the scribe is just randomly adding a q in some cases, shouldn't the ratios be roughly equal?

Each word is related to all other similarly spelled words! The source word for qokaiin is not necessary okaiin like in <f86v6.P.16> taiin okaiin qokaiin. It is also possible that the source word for qokaiin was a word like aiiin like in <f107v.P.3> sain ain aiiin qokaiin.

You expect that it should be possible to calculate the exact frequencies for each word. This would indicate a level of order in the VMS I would expect for a cipher. The auto-copying hypotheses on the other hand suggests that the VMS was written manually. For someone writing the script by copying words already written there was no need to count the number of times he was writing this or that word. Therefore it is expected for the auto-copying hypothesis that the frequencies for the words vary.
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Messages In This Thread
A key to understand the VMS - by Torsten - 01-01-2017, 08:14 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Davidsch - 01-01-2017, 09:43 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Torsten - 01-01-2017, 09:59 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Davidsch - 01-01-2017, 10:15 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Sam G - 04-01-2017, 03:25 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by stellar - 04-01-2017, 04:15 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Torsten - 04-01-2017, 05:56 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Torsten - 04-01-2017, 08:32 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Sam G - 05-01-2017, 12:24 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Torsten - 04-01-2017, 11:56 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Sam G - 05-01-2017, 12:39 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by stellar - 04-02-2017, 08:05 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Torsten - 05-01-2017, 06:26 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Sam G - 07-01-2017, 11:14 AM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by ThomasCoon - 07-01-2017, 02:42 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by VViews - 07-01-2017, 03:16 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by -JKP- - 07-01-2017, 03:41 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Torsten - 07-01-2017, 05:38 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Sam G - 07-01-2017, 06:42 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by VViews - 08-01-2017, 11:20 AM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Koen G - 07-01-2017, 05:50 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Torsten - 07-01-2017, 08:55 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Sam G - 08-01-2017, 02:11 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Torsten - 08-01-2017, 03:24 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Sam G - 08-01-2017, 03:54 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by stellar - 08-01-2017, 04:15 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Torsten - 08-01-2017, 04:22 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by stellar - 08-01-2017, 05:29 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by stellar - 08-01-2017, 05:43 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by stellar - 08-01-2017, 05:55 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by stellar - 08-01-2017, 06:02 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by stellar - 08-01-2017, 08:20 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Davidsch - 09-01-2017, 01:15 AM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by stellar - 09-01-2017, 10:02 AM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Psillycyber - 10-01-2017, 02:00 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Psillycyber - 10-01-2017, 02:21 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Sam G - 10-01-2017, 03:07 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by ThomasCoon - 10-01-2017, 07:15 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Sam G - 10-01-2017, 07:57 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Sam G - 10-01-2017, 04:16 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Psillycyber - 10-01-2017, 05:08 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Sam G - 10-01-2017, 05:34 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Torsten - 10-01-2017, 05:24 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Sam G - 10-01-2017, 05:55 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Torsten - 10-01-2017, 06:41 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Sam G - 10-01-2017, 07:22 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Torsten - 10-01-2017, 09:16 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by ThomasCoon - 10-01-2017, 08:24 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Psillycyber - 10-01-2017, 10:17 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Torsten - 11-01-2017, 11:43 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Torsten - 12-01-2017, 12:25 AM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Torsten - 03-02-2017, 12:54 AM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by ThomasCoon - 03-02-2017, 03:04 AM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Wladimir D - 03-02-2017, 10:41 AM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by -JKP- - 03-02-2017, 10:45 AM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by ReneZ - 03-02-2017, 08:04 AM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by MarcoP - 03-02-2017, 01:46 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Torsten - 18-02-2017, 08:00 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Torsten - 03-02-2017, 09:52 AM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Ruby Novacna - 03-02-2017, 01:33 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Davidsch - 03-02-2017, 03:09 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Koen G - 03-02-2017, 04:03 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Torsten - 03-02-2017, 04:59 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Torsten - 03-02-2017, 05:12 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Davidsch - 03-02-2017, 05:29 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by stellar - 03-02-2017, 06:15 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Torsten - 03-02-2017, 06:42 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by stellar - 03-02-2017, 06:51 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by stellar - 03-02-2017, 07:15 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Koen G - 03-02-2017, 08:12 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Torsten - 03-02-2017, 09:52 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Sam G - 04-02-2017, 06:47 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Torsten - 03-02-2017, 10:16 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Torsten - 03-02-2017, 11:05 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by stellar - 03-02-2017, 11:53 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by davidjackson - 04-02-2017, 09:17 AM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by ReneZ - 04-02-2017, 11:57 AM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Torsten - 04-02-2017, 02:06 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Torsten - 04-02-2017, 07:19 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Sam G - 04-02-2017, 07:33 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by stellar - 04-02-2017, 07:24 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Torsten - 04-02-2017, 09:25 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Torsten - 04-02-2017, 09:41 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Torsten - 04-02-2017, 10:11 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Torsten - 04-02-2017, 10:15 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Torsten - 05-02-2017, 12:18 AM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Koen G - 05-02-2017, 12:35 AM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Torsten - 05-02-2017, 01:23 AM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by stellar - 05-02-2017, 02:02 AM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Torsten - 05-02-2017, 03:21 AM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Torsten - 05-02-2017, 01:19 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by nickpelling - 05-02-2017, 01:55 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Torsten - 05-02-2017, 03:58 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Torsten - 05-02-2017, 04:16 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by nickpelling - 05-02-2017, 05:23 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Torsten - 05-02-2017, 08:55 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Torsten - 06-02-2017, 01:12 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Torsten - 05-02-2017, 10:34 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Davidsch - 05-02-2017, 03:20 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by stellar - 05-02-2017, 04:20 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by nickpelling - 05-02-2017, 05:35 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Torsten - 05-02-2017, 07:49 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by nickpelling - 05-02-2017, 09:36 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Torsten - 05-02-2017, 11:14 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by davidjackson - 05-02-2017, 06:21 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by stellar - 05-02-2017, 09:05 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by stellar - 05-02-2017, 09:23 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by stellar - 05-02-2017, 11:28 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by nickpelling - 06-02-2017, 02:07 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Torsten - 06-02-2017, 04:14 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by nickpelling - 07-02-2017, 12:52 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Torsten - 07-02-2017, 09:52 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by nickpelling - 08-02-2017, 10:42 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Torsten - 09-02-2017, 01:34 AM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Koen G - 07-02-2017, 01:30 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Torsten - 07-02-2017, 10:05 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Koen G - 08-02-2017, 11:10 AM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Torsten - 08-02-2017, 07:23 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Sam G - 08-02-2017, 12:52 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Davidsch - 08-02-2017, 02:42 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Sam G - 08-02-2017, 03:06 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Koen G - 08-02-2017, 03:11 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Davidsch - 08-02-2017, 03:18 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Koen G - 08-02-2017, 04:06 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Davidsch - 08-02-2017, 07:12 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by ThomasCoon - 09-02-2017, 03:15 AM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by stellar - 09-02-2017, 03:55 AM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Torsten - 09-02-2017, 07:48 AM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Davidsch - 09-02-2017, 03:04 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by ThomasCoon - 10-02-2017, 03:01 AM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Davidsch - 18-02-2017, 10:44 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by ReneZ - 19-02-2017, 08:26 AM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Torsten - 19-02-2017, 10:10 AM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Sam G - 19-02-2017, 10:47 AM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Torsten - 19-02-2017, 10:51 AM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Sam G - 19-02-2017, 11:25 AM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Sam G - 19-02-2017, 11:30 AM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Torsten - 20-02-2017, 08:15 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Sam G - 21-02-2017, 10:41 AM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Torsten - 21-02-2017, 08:40 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Torsten - 22-02-2017, 01:11 AM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Torsten - 22-02-2017, 09:47 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Sam G - 23-02-2017, 09:43 AM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by nickpelling - 23-02-2017, 10:01 AM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Torsten - 23-02-2017, 12:45 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Sam G - 23-02-2017, 02:34 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Torsten - 23-02-2017, 10:17 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Sam G - 24-02-2017, 01:45 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Torsten - 25-02-2017, 01:27 AM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Davidsch - 20-02-2017, 11:28 AM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Torsten - 20-02-2017, 08:53 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Davidsch - 21-02-2017, 11:07 AM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Torsten - 21-02-2017, 09:15 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Davidsch - 22-02-2017, 11:44 AM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Torsten - 24-02-2017, 07:02 AM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Sam G - 22-02-2017, 05:04 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Diane - 23-02-2017, 02:26 AM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by -JKP- - 23-02-2017, 08:42 AM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Koen G - 23-02-2017, 08:14 AM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by -JKP- - 23-02-2017, 09:58 AM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Sam G - 23-02-2017, 10:41 AM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by -JKP- - 23-02-2017, 11:20 AM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by ReneZ - 23-02-2017, 11:35 AM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Sam G - 23-02-2017, 12:18 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by ReneZ - 23-02-2017, 01:12 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Sam G - 23-02-2017, 02:58 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by -JKP- - 23-02-2017, 11:42 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by ReneZ - 24-02-2017, 09:11 AM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by nickpelling - 23-02-2017, 07:14 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by -JKP- - 23-02-2017, 12:01 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Koen G - 23-02-2017, 10:21 AM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Koen G - 23-02-2017, 12:31 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Sam G - 23-02-2017, 03:08 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by ReneZ - 23-02-2017, 03:44 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Davidsch - 23-02-2017, 04:05 PM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Koen G - 24-02-2017, 03:50 AM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by -JKP- - 24-02-2017, 04:55 AM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by -JKP- - 24-02-2017, 05:20 AM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Koen G - 24-02-2017, 09:39 AM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Diane - 24-02-2017, 11:00 AM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by -JKP- - 24-02-2017, 11:45 AM
RE: A key to understand the VMS - by Diane - 24-02-2017, 11:29 PM

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