[split] St John's College MS. 18

[DONJCH]

There is a really interesting one on P50 of this collection by Don Hoffman
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Roland of Lisbon St Johns College Oxford MS18 Reductiorum Physiognomie

I was surprised not to see this one on a search of Voynich Ninja, it MUST have been discussed before!

Seems to be naked male "nymphs" representing 12 constellations and 7 planets.

[Koen G]

DONJCH posted this in the "nudes" thread, but I think it deserves its own. The reason why we have not (apparently?) discussed this image yet may be that he MS is not digitized. 

Here is an entry at the Bodleian You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
And here is a page at St Johns where they say that only three of their medieval MSS have been digitized; You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.

This image must be available somewhere of course, since Don found it. Here is a screenshot from his pdf:

   

[Koen G]

Rather than the nude figures representing the planets themselves, I would guess they represent people influenced by the planets, since those are shining on them? Though who is influenced by the Sun?

[-JKP-]

Like Zodiac man, parts of the body that are influenced by the constellations (top) and planets (bottom).

It's not exactly the same, the hands do not point to the same parts as Zodiac man, but maybe it's just basically suggestive of the same concept.

There were figures like this at the Baths of Pozzuoli, with gestures toward parts of the body presumably that could be helped by certain pools/baths.

[Helmut Winkler]

It rather looks like the Lisbon ms., Lisbon, Biblioteca d’Ajuda MS 52,XII,18

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Edit: and not the St. Johns ms., cp. the ms. information given by the Bodley Library

[bi3mw]

I find it remarkable that so much naked people are under zodiac signs and stars at all. Unfortunately, I can not read the text. I would really like to know what this illustration is about.

[Koen G]

They are extremely similar yet different

   

[DONJCH]

Here is a screenshot from his pdf:

Hm, I pondered whether it was okay to take a direct copy like that.

[DONJCH]

Also, not really seeing the pointing to different parts of the body like Zodiac man, rather I see mostly gesticulating as if in debate with some covering of genitals.

I mean, if it was ZM the brain is Aries and the feet are Pisces yet neither, indeed nobody points to head or feet

Hope somebody can read Helmut's version as an explanation would be interesting!

[-JKP-]

12 on the top row (zodiacs/constellations). 7 on the bottom (ruling planets).

I wasn't drawing a direct relationship to zodiac man, I was trying to draw a more general parallel to the concept. Just as the stars were believed to affect certain parts of the body and certain parts were only supposed to be treated on certain days, a similar concept was applied to bathing at the various spas. The different pools were supposed to be good for different parts of the body (this is what it says in the text of the baths of Pozzuoli) and there used to be frescoes there (or possibly mosaics), before it was destroyed, with rows of people pointing.

We know the 7 are related to the "planets" because it clearly shows sun, moon, and five stars.