The Voynich Ninja

(06-07-2019, 03:24 PM)Monica Yokubinas Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.Every illustration on the botanical pages, tells a story in its exaggerated depiction. Take for example f34v. The plant is a heartwort, used as a pot herb, but the roots are exaggerated to depict 2 deer. Heartwort was eaten by female deers after giving birth, so this aided in its story, so another would know exactly which plant they were describing. Here is my translation of the page.

 To give peace, I rest a beautiful preserved rest. The lion of preserved calm rest, a foundation I rest, of temple rest, long live the seed, come sweep away, watch like a grave the resting seed. Grave of the Lord of Seeds to have as a possession, Lord of to grasp the heel of wealth, turn aside and gird oneself in winter. Valley of vision, how long preserved, I run to and fro, at that time I rest. My own thorn bush, how long at that time, a long lived provision. Watcher of the Lord, a messenger in winter in the forest thicket, a beautiful silence in preserved seed.  A handful restraint, heals what? Gird up thorn bush Khazars thorn bush, my own seed Chief sister. Radiant appearance extended with no adversary, preserve the very pretty seed and rest in relief with this weapon. My own seed to plant a garden of beautify silence and sweat. 

Eat heartily of the thorn bush, beautiful thorn bush in the cooking pot like about 1 quart of dry measure. Beauty at that time, wood but sweep away. My own seed kind of plant the thorn bush a beauty in poverty, then poverty. My own seed a beauty of the cold, to remove seeds to rest and cover of the leaves. Market stall they in a trodden place, brother traveler, in the father valley brother thorn bush. Thorn bush, take advantage of swept away, beauty and take away, gird up the head how long? Gird up thorn bush raining on thorn bush a sign. Radiant appearance with tire of the head in beauty, of strength to walk and rest. He rest, beauty rest, cover and I rest this visionary dreamer and enter at that time the impoverished chief. I rest and seek out his rest because Aha! Rest Lord of beauty. I rest they sweep away beauty thorn bush. How long? Dry measure (7 quarts) of seed a sign, but preserved how long? Enter weaver because sweep away leaves of tree and preserve the seed.

I have been translating a few pages of the Voynich and found some interesting information. 1: the flowers and leaves will coincide with a Hebrew alphabet. 52r for an example has 4,6,4 leaves with a crown flower. Crown for King. Leaves 4 Daleth, 6 Vav, 4 Daleth = David or basket or beloved one. I will transcribe in the morning, very disturbing stuff. But line 6 says: "Like a broken man to torment/remove, Like Lord oath secret in to know Aramaic language, Life oath evil wickedness baker premature baby/unripe fruit, Rephaim/ ghosts of the dead to command." 
35r 2: plant 8,2 Heart or secretly, Line 1: "long live alas to to seek in a strange language, proper confusion to give advice, to plot together." I'll get the 4 pages done and transcribed in the morning. Have a great night

What I see in this translation of You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. is similar to what I see in many proposed translations: this is not meaningful text, but incoherent rambling.

Another problem is that the original text has 119 'words' and the translation has 341. That is essentially a factor 3 and that is way too much. No matter how one explains this expansion, it means that two thirds of the proposed plain text (order of magnitude) is actually not represented in the Voynich MS text.

(08-07-2019, 04:00 AM)ReneZ Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.What I see in this translation of You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. is similar to what I see in many proposed translations: this is not meaningful text, but incoherent rambling.

Another problem is that the original text has 119 'words' and the translation has 341. That is essentially a factor 3 and that is way too much. No matter how one explains this expansion, it means that two thirds of the proposed plain text (order of magnitude) is actually not represented in the Voynich MS text.

If the word is 2 letters long like 'RA' for example and can have duel meaning either evil or friend, I place both in the translation when unsure,
and other words like 'Ran' literally means 'Joyful song' or a 3 letter word 'yga' means 'that which is labored for' 
How many of those words do you want me to take out so it looks nice and even for you?
I will repeat this ad nauseum: This is not the Hebrew language, but someone utilizing a Semitic type language like a secret code. I can only give a meaning to each word, not proper syntax.

(08-07-2019, 11:52 AM)Monica Yokubinas Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view....   a 3 letter word 'yga' means 'that which is labored for' 

This did not appear in the translation, and I also did not see anything similar. It would only account for a fraction of the increase.

The proposed translation method is a hypothesis. One way of proving that this hypothesis could be right is by translating some significant piece of text and showing that this becomes meaningful. It would also be necessary to show how this plain text was converted into the Voynich MS text that we see.

This is a general comment, not specific to this particular solution.

The meaning of my comment is that this confirmation has not been achieved. The text is not meaningful, and has the other problem of being way too long, i.e. most of it has been added from nowhere.

(08-07-2019, 12:32 PM)ReneZ Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.

(08-07-2019, 11:52 AM)Monica Yokubinas Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view....   a 3 letter word 'yga' means 'that which is labored for' 

This did not appear in the translation, and I also did not see anything similar. It would only account for a fraction of the increase.

The proposed translation method is a hypothesis. One way of proving that this hypothesis could be right is by translating some significant piece of text and showing that this becomes meaningful. It would also be necessary to show how this plain text was converted into the Voynich MS text that we see.

This is a general comment, not specific to this particular solution.

The meaning of my comment is that this confirmation has not been achieved. The text is not meaningful, and has the other problem of being way too long, i.e. most of it has been added from nowhere.

This is why it is 'too long'. In the first You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. is an example of an agglutinative word or a combination of words the 3rd word in the combination means "to speak an strange/unintelligible language" so "Long live Alas, to speak a strange language long live". That is the meaning of the very first word, and i forgot to add the AL for the word God in it, which would add another word to the agglutinative blend.
The next example is just a word but I would still write "Aramaic language" in translating so another will gain a better understanding.
Here is the entire workup from You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. I have one for every page i have translated.

(08-07-2019, 12:56 PM)Monica Yokubinas Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.

(08-07-2019, 12:32 PM)ReneZ Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.

(08-07-2019, 11:52 AM)Monica Yokubinas Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view....   a 3 letter word 'yga' means 'that which is labored for' 

This did not appear in the translation, and I also did not see anything similar. It would only account for a fraction of the increase.

The proposed translation method is a hypothesis. One way of proving that this hypothesis could be right is by translating some significant piece of text and showing that this becomes meaningful. It would also be necessary to show how this plain text was converted into the Voynich MS text that we see.

This is a general comment, not specific to this particular solution.

The meaning of my comment is that this confirmation has not been achieved. The text is not meaningful, and has the other problem of being way too long, i.e. most of it has been added from nowhere.

This is why it is 'too long'. In the first You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. is an example of an agglutinative word or a combination of words the 3rd word in the combination means "to speak an strange/unintelligible language" so "Long live Alas, to speak a strange language long live". That is the meaning of the very first word, and i forgot to add the AL for the word God in it, which would add another word to the agglutinative blend.
The next example is just a word but I would still write "Aramaic language" in translating so another will gain a better understanding.
Here is the entire workup from You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. I have one for every page i have translated.

Translation of the 35r page produced some strange information and I had to research and make sure this information was correct... to my surprise it was. The placenta was known in the middle ages as the 'tree of life' it is listed in the Voynich as 'a living thing', 'worm' and ' source of origin' on page 35r. it is listed as the 'Sheath of the Spirit" on the 9 rosette folio. 35r also says it has the power to 'renew or repair oneself' when consumed. The medical practice is called placentophagy:
 "The afterbirth was taken to increase the secretion of milk, which in all the women had failed without obvious cause after previous confinements. The treatment is said to have been successful after other methods of stimulating the milk secretion had failed. The placenta was used in antiquity in the Middle Ages as a remedy in difficult labour"  [font=Calibri, sans-serif]You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.[/font]
Here is the translation of 34v:
 Long live, Alas God to speak in a strange language, long live proper confusion to plot together in an instant. A handful of rebellion, does strength remove in a deep sleep. Beginning barefoot premature baby, strength fair of sense, Lord God. Strength to remove, to sweep inner parts Lord than living creature/substance, source of origin, dormant little brother. Grandmother live living creature/substance to split open. Deep sleep, dormant God alas lifeblood to devour, came forth. Source of origin to now humankind, profane Lord of barefoot premature baby, to expel/remove worm source of origin.

[font=Calibri, sans-serif]To vanish fair hated one, worm fair hated one, to know God lifeblood. Alas! Lifeblood, my own lifeblood, Lord toward atonement. Alas island/demon worm, to sweep fair lifeblood atonement, long live lifeblood movement worm/monstrous splendor. Listen messenger to run forth, greedy of gain resting, then God redeem my own life blood, redeem to renew oneself. To happen premature baby to dream, rest fair lifeblood. This lifeblood my own worm, this my own worm trembler of this secret of firepot mouth premature baby lifeblood. Long live then unite lifeblood strength which is labored for. Firepot my own God in a deep sleep to know then strength lifeblood. There is no worship shrine in a deep sleep, burst forth lifeblood[/font]

Page 75r:
Upper 10 words translation:
Mire to be rooted up, to moisten in the body, loot to remove please. To burst forth blatant, to gather of desire.
Paragraph translation: (first 10 lines)
Live to breach a promise this hated one of form seduced. Beauty of husk pressure powerful thorn bush. Sweep away this to breach a promise of strength of the hated one, to sweep away fruitful up to this point gently, become beautiful. Oh please beauty at that time, like this beauty rest. Beauty assembled as a group, breathe out rest primordial waters, dew of the Lord, bright as colorful flowers. Heron/Position of honor, handful of peace, raise the price of privilege, to be heated hated one, how long? Sweep premature baby, a weapon of beauty bubbling spring, trembler of beauty dream, rest, sweep premature baby, God to sweep premature baby. Something hallowed to split into pieces, house early fruit relief, remove Lord hated one in heat/fire at that time. Sweep fair poppy hollowed unripe fruit, hollowed of house poppy up to this point, sweep rest. Bridle to fly up to this point to become green. My own long life of hallowed poppy, hallowed of young/seeds fair up to this point hated one rest. This to become green, my own poppy, to be vexed an hour. Vex lactating breast, my own poppy up to this point. Hallowed poppy, my own Lord of bright colorful flowers to be healed. Lord of pillows* , my own Lord of trembler poppy, branch poppy companion vexed up to this point, fool be afraid. Up to this point poppy hallowed cometh out to sweep Lord of vexed hated one, then my own poppy contempt, hallowed poppy pillows*, then exhaust oneself of pillows*. My own Lord of rest, firepot premature baby innocent rest, blossom poppy. You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. 
*pillows Strongs # 3704, was used in the King James Bible in Ezekiel 13: 18-20. Breaking down the word would be “full moon + cometh out” = menstruation.  After reading the verses, they coincide with the 9 rosette folio causing abortions, and using the fetus/branch for nefarious means.
Poppy was used to help relieve pain and bring menstruation and is mentioned by Nicholas Culpeper in 1649, in Culpeper’s The Complete Herbal.
Lastly a picture in Alchemical symbolism. The tree is the Source of Origin (placenta) the basket pictured is the womb, and the branch is the child. Notice the ladies bathing at the bottom. 
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(13-07-2019, 04:49 PM)Monica Yokubinas Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.....
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The picture in alchemy symbolism looks like it is from one of the Splendor Solis editions (mid to late 16th century). Is that correct ?

Edit: OK, I found it, British Library, Ms. Harley 3469, You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.

Quote:Description:
Miniature of a man on a ladder climbing a tree and offering a branch to two robed men; marginal drawing shows David watching Bathsheba and her ladies bathing.

(13-07-2019, 04:49 PM)Monica Yokubinas Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.Page 75r:
Upper 10 words translation:
Mire to be rooted up, to moisten in the body, loot to remove please. To burst forth blatant, to gather of desire.
Paragraph translation: (first 10 lines)
Live to breach a promise this hated one of form seduced. Beauty of husk pressure powerful thorn bush. Sweep away this to breach a promise of strength of the hated one, to sweep away fruitful up to this point gently, become beautiful. Oh please beauty at that time, like this beauty rest. Beauty assembled as a group, breathe out rest primordial waters, dew of the Lord, bright as colorful flowers. Heron/Position of honor, handful of peace, raise the price of privilege, to be heated hated one, how long? Sweep premature baby, a weapon of beauty bubbling spring, trembler of beauty dream, rest, sweep premature baby, God to sweep premature baby. Something hallowed to split into pieces, house early fruit relief, remove Lord hated one in heat/fire at that time. Sweep fair poppy hollowed unripe fruit, hollowed of house poppy up to this point, sweep rest. Bridle to fly up to this point to become green. My own long life of hallowed poppy, hallowed of young/seeds fair up to this point hated one rest. This to become green, my own poppy, to be vexed an hour. Vex lactating breast, my own poppy up to this point. Hallowed poppy, my own Lord of bright colorful flowers to be healed. Lord of pillows* , my own Lord of trembler poppy, branch poppy companion vexed up to this point, fool be afraid. Up to this point poppy hallowed cometh out to sweep Lord of vexed hated one, then my own poppy contempt, hallowed poppy pillows*, then exhaust oneself of pillows*. My own Lord of rest, firepot premature baby innocent rest, blossom poppy. You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. 
*pillows Strongs # 3704, was used in the King James Bible in Ezekiel 13: 18-20. Breaking down the word would be “full moon + cometh out” = menstruation.  After reading the verses, they coincide with the 9 rosette folio causing abortions, and using the fetus/branch for nefarious means.
Poppy was used to help relieve pain and bring menstruation and is mentioned by Nicholas Culpeper in 1649, in Culpeper’s The Complete Herbal.
Lastly a picture in Alchemical symbolism. The tree is the Source of Origin (placenta) the basket pictured is the womb, and the branch is the child. Notice the ladies bathing at the bottom. 
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Monica, i have my own interpretation of this page based on the imagery and unfortunately i don't see much in the way of commonality with your take and mine. I can't comment on your methods as i dont have knowledge in that area, but i do find it interesting, it might well be a parallel theme to the one i see, i was thinking about You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. and that the top image there seems like a womb to many and i can see that too, and there i can correlate my other ideas with the idea of cradle of modern civilization, perhaps this one is of a similar vein, but one which did not see fruition, or saw destruction. In my interpretation it is one of the last areas known to the western world besides those not shown. Also the business of opium trade is largest in the area of the world i relate to this page.

(13-07-2019, 05:29 PM)bi3mw Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.

(13-07-2019, 04:49 PM)Monica Yokubinas Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.....
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.

The picture in alchemy symbolism looks like it is from one of the Splendor Solis editions (mid to late 16th century). Is that correct ?

Edit: OK, I found it, British Library, Ms. Harley 3469, You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.

Quote:Description:
Miniature of a man on a ladder climbing a tree and offering a branch to two robed men; marginal drawing shows David watching Bathsheba and her ladies bathing.

 Introduction of the Great Work, from the manuscript Splendor Solis by Solomon Trismosin. Sorry I forgot to tad the picture, as I was having a hard time adding it.