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• Solutions [discussion thread - moved]

• RE: Solutions [discussion thread - moved]

  Mark Knowles > 08-08-2024, 12:57 PM

  (07-08-2024, 11:03 PM)Koen G Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.Tavie's list is specifically about theories discussed at Voynich Ninja, which is why a lot of theories are not present.

  
  Personally, I am interested in all theories, it is not important to me whether they have been discussed on Voynich Ninja or elsewhere. That's why, from my point of view, if someone undertakes to create a list of theories then it is nice to see the whole sweep of theories. However each to their own, I guess.

• RE: Solutions [discussion thread - moved]

  Koen G > 08-08-2024, 01:48 PM

  So you actually read and evaluate all of these 50+ theories?

• RE: Solutions [discussion thread - moved]

  Mark Knowles > 08-08-2024, 02:30 PM

  (08-08-2024, 01:48 PM)Koen G Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.So you actually read and evaluate all of these 50+ theories?

  
  Is that necessary? It is intriguing to have an overview of all the different theories, so as to get a sense of commonalities and differences. To me the more complete the list the better.
  
  However Tavie is certainly welcome to compile whichever lists he wants to; I mean it's his time.

• RE: Solutions [discussion thread - moved]

  Koen G > 08-08-2024, 07:47 PM

  Well yes, more is more, but you got go start somewhere. I wonder how many theories have been published somewhere that did not make the list. Maybe mostly older ones?
  
  What I like the most about the list is that despite its limited scope it still highlights the manuscript's tremendous power to send otherwise intelligent people down confirmation bias loops. The Voynich theorist is often portrayed as a madman, but I think the truth is different. Most of the solvers on this list (with a few exceptions who are not posting on the forum) are well meaning, intelligent people. And they all vehemently believe that they solved the MS, because confirmation bias told them so. 
  
  Even if one person on the list is right, that still means that 50 are wrong. All of these people stepped forward with their theory, convinced that they would be the one to finally save us from our misery, and probably to this day still convinced that they solved the mystery but nobody would listen.

• RE: Solutions [discussion thread - moved]

  Mark Knowles > 09-08-2024, 09:10 AM

  (08-08-2024, 07:47 PM)Koen G Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.Well yes, more is more, but you got go start somewhere. I wonder how many theories have been published somewhere that did not make the list. Maybe mostly older ones?
  
  What I like the most about the list is that despite its limited scope it still highlights the manuscript's tremendous power to send otherwise intelligent people down confirmation bias loops. The Voynich theorist is often portrayed as a madman, but I think the truth is different. Most of the solvers on this list (with a few exceptions who are not posting on the forum) are well meaning, intelligent people. And they all vehemently believe that they solved the MS, because confirmation bias told them so. 
  
  Even if one person on the list is right, that still means that 50 are wrong. All of these people stepped forward with their theory, convinced that they would be the one to finally save us from our misery, and probably to this day still convinced that they solved the mystery but nobody would listen.

  
  As others have said before, it could be that many people have made the same mistake is their decipherment process.

• RE: Solutions [discussion thread - moved]

  ReneZ > 09-08-2024, 12:22 PM

  It is beyond any doubt that the majority of would-be Voynich solvers have been making the same mistake over and over. This is also true for numerous solutions proposed at this forum, some of which are still being actively pursued.
  
  I agree with Koen that the vast majority of would-be solvers are intelligent and well-meaning people, but it stops at the point where people are completely uncritical of their own arguments.
  
  One has to be as critical of one's own arguments as one is of those of others.
  
  One may call the lack of this capability 'confirmation bias', but I think that it is a bigger fault.

• RE: Solutions [discussion thread - moved]

  Mark Knowles > 09-08-2024, 12:49 PM

  I think a lot of decipherers aren't aware that they are repeating the same mistakes as others before them as they tend to start with a blank slate on which they build their theories. I think there is a place for different theories and I, personally, think it is a positive thing even if others don't, but when those theories are methodologically equivalent then they are really the same theory repeated again and again. And that is what we tend to see the same theory repeated albeit with different proposed languages.

• RE: Solutions [discussion thread - moved]

  BessAgritianin > 09-08-2024, 04:53 PM

  (07-08-2024, 07:09 AM)ReneZ Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.Is BessAgritianin's proposed solution only referring to the You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. text that uses the Roman or Latin alphabet?
  If so, then I would not count it.
  If it also proposes to translate some of the Voynich text, then it can be counted, IMHO.

  
  WOW,
  I have translations of some other pages too. Partially. Anyone who thinks that understands everything is genius maybe...
  I know who the author is, which nobody seems to dream of. 
  Remember, the author is the turning point of all other theories!!!! And you want to exclude the only truthful texts from further discussions?
  Very interesting.
  Do You really want a deciphering, or you like the dreaming world of all ideas more?
  
  Success!

• RE: Solutions [discussion thread - moved]

  BessAgritianin > 09-08-2024, 05:02 PM

  Another thought for TAVI.
  Why the number of the theories determines Your golden medals?
  Is it not what truth is that is worth golden evaluation. There is an explanation about the Latin theories- the alphabet. But the Czechs have the same Latin alphabet since the middle ages because of the church. 
  BR: Vessy

• RE: Solutions [discussion thread - moved]

  BessAgritianin > 09-08-2024, 05:28 PM

  Let us say, We have hundreds of researchers, who are pretending to have found the solution of VM. 
  If only one of them is telling the truth and all the rest are disillusioned, how do you decide?
  Do we say - because of the magnitude we select the most, or do you consider the logic behind, who is telling the truth? 
  If you invite me on a talk I am ready to disclose some of my translations and dispute with the rest of the colleagues about the truth. 
   I am a Patent Engineer and do not want to disclose everything on a web page. I don't want that in future someone else puts his or her name under my findings...Nobody wants this. 
  BR: Vessy
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