Juan_Sali > 11-01-2023, 02:56 PM
(10-01-2023, 10:45 PM)degaskell Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.we recruited human participants to produce real, handwritten samples of meaningless text and compared them statistically to Voynichese.If the VMS is an hoax, how was the process of creation? Was it created in a session or was a longer process, something like a learning curve? A process with corrections until they considered that the result was acceptable. An experiment to reproduce a quick creation may be possible, but if it is not the conditions to reproduce the creation process will be very difficult to recreate.
RobGea > 11-01-2023, 04:40 PM
(10-01-2023, 10:45 PM)degaskell Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.how to more rigorously test whether the Voynich is meaningful or not.
ReneZ > 14-01-2023, 03:33 AM
MarcoP > 14-01-2023, 09:58 AM
(14-01-2023, 03:33 AM)ReneZ Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.My own brief thoughts have been along thought experiments like the following:
1) Take a known plain text, which can be quite long
2) Create a list of words that appear in this text, according to decreasing frequency
3) Put the list of Voynichese words sorted by descreasing frequency next to it
4) Substitute the plain text words by Voynichese words according to this table .
This results in a text using valid Voynichese words that has a meaning.
Now the question: how can we detect that this has meaning? ( = Question 1)
ReneZ > 15-01-2023, 04:56 AM
degaskell > 15-01-2023, 07:45 PM
Koen G > 15-01-2023, 09:36 PM
bi3mw > 15-01-2023, 09:57 PM
Koen G > 15-01-2023, 10:43 PM
(15-01-2023, 09:57 PM)bi3mw Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.@Koen: Didn't you have collected meaningless texts here in the forum some time ago ? But unfortunately I can no longer remember the corresponding thread.
MarcoP > 15-01-2023, 11:33 PM
(15-01-2023, 09:57 PM)bi3mw Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.@Koen: Didn't you have collected meaningless texts here in the forum some time ago ? But unfortunately I can no longer remember the corresponding thread.
(15-01-2023, 07:45 PM)degaskell Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.The two general approaches outlined above (MATTR and vocabulary-matching) seem promising, but I think they both suffer from the problem that they are fundamentally measures of structure rather than measures of meaning. It's easy enough to take structure as a reasonably proxy for meaning, but as our experiments show, it is quite possible for a text to be both structured and meaningless.
Quote:And I beheld, and, lo, in the midst of the throne and of the four beasts, and in the midst of the elders, stood a Lamb as it had been slain, having seven horns and seven eyes, which are the seven Spirits of God sent forth into all the earth. And he came and took the book out of the right hand of him that sat upon the throne. And when he had taken the book, the four beasts and four and twenty elders fell down before the Lamb, having every one of them harps, and golden vials full of odours, which are the prayers of saints.