(16-10-2018, 08:48 PM)Koen Gh. Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.Here are the date ranges for the examples I posted. I only looked them up now because I like to keep my selections "blind" as much as possible as to not influence myself. For reference I'll repost the image.
I try to do that too. While I'm gathering, I try NOT to look at what country, what date, etc., I grab the image, copy and paste the bibliographical data without reading it, and then look for more.
It's not until I have a certain "base" number that I start looking at statistics.
For example, with the zodiac cycles, I didn't feel comfortable making generalizations until I had more than 350 complete zodiac cycles, and even then I squirmed while talking about it. After 500, THEN I felt like I could confidently BEGIN to pull out some patterns.
The same with samples of text that match the marginalia. I wasn't really confident saying anything about them until I had close to 1,000 samples (which is more than 40,000 individual letters) and I'm STILL collecting, trying to get better data.
With the crossbows, tunics, and sleeves, it was more difficult to get the kind of raw numbers one might hope to find, but this isn't always possible and sometimes rarity becomes an asset as it will occasionally point you in the right direction with less data.
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All of which leads me to the dagged sleeves...
I haven't been talking about it much and haven't mapped it yet, because I found it very hard to find good examples (I'm glad Koen started this thread because I'm not sure I would ever have found enough on my own) and now VViews has posted a good example of what I was hoping to find—delicate, tight, almost lace-like dagging (in fact, I tried to look for lacy sleeves as well ones in which the sleeve fabric itself was dagged). Good example, and POSSIBLY what the VMS illustrator was trying to draw.
Here is one that expressly illustrates an alternative to dagged sleeves. The VMS picture is small and imprecise, so it occurred to me it MIGHT be dagged sleeves or it might be lacy sleeves:
The difference might matter.
Lace was handmade and very expensive.
Dagging was the "poor nobleman's" alternative to lace. It looked a bit like lace sleeves but was created simply by incising the fabric, a process that takes minutes compared to the months it takes to make lace (left picture tatted lace; right picture bobbin or crochet lace).
If it is lace, it might fit economically with the very long pouch on the bowman's hat. More fabric frequently meant more money and higher social status.
More lace here: You are not allowed to view links.
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More dagged: You are not allowed to view links.
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Login to view. (inside looks like a fuzzy fabric, maybe animal fur? rabbit?
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Bibliographic info on NAL 1673:
Colloquial name(s): Tacuinum sanitatis, by Ibn Butlân
Official name(s): Bibliothèque nationale de France, Nouvelle acquisition latine 1673
Date: 1390-1400 (source, Mandragore) or 1380-90 (You are not allowed to view links.
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Origin: Pavia or Milan, Lombardy, N. Italy, by Giovannino de Grassi's workshop (You are not allowed to view links.
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