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Another "thing" (77v)

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• Another "thing" (77v)

• Another "thing" (77v)

  Koen G > 07-06-2017, 10:24 AM

  I was going over the nymph objects again and I can't remember if anyone has ever found a parallel for this one:
  
     
  
  It's not just the identification of the object itself which is problematic, but also the way it is held and the pose of its nymph. 
  

  • At first sight, one would say that she is holding it in her mouth, but if the drawing's accuracy at this scale is to be trusted, this is not the case. the object appears to pass behind her face, against her cheek. 
    
  • Her hair appears to have a knot in it where the object crosses it, which raises the strange possibility that it is in fact tied to her hair. Again, this is hard to tell given the size of the drawing.
    
  • Her lips slightly part, as if she's blowing at the object. An important note here may be that in a first pass her face was drawn slim, but then a curved line has been added to her cheek to make it appear puffy. This lends credibility to a "blowing" interpretation. Or whistling? 
    
  • Her arms are held in an unnatural, even impossible position. Challenge: find a large mirror, stand in front of it and hold your arms like this. It will only work if you're made of pudding. Their positioning is more appropriate for wings (bird's or angel's). 
    
  • The base ends in a weird leg with three "toes".
    

  The nymph appears to be blowing over or into the object, which has been marked with a black spot. This spot looks intentional, it is not just an overly thick line. From the object some kind of lines are connected to the water below, and blue marks have been applied to the lines, possibly also indicating water.
  
  So... Anyone?

• RE: Another "thing" (77v)

  -JKP- > 07-06-2017, 10:37 AM

  I have no idea.
  
  But, it reminds me a bit of a blown bubble, blown from one of those large rings that makes a long thin filmy sausage-shaped bubble.

• RE: Another "thing" (77v)

  VViews > 07-06-2017, 11:44 AM

  Thanks for starting this thread Koen Gh,
  Whatever is being depicted beside this nymph only gets weirder the closer you look at it.
  First, let's look at the top part:
  
  Whatever is protruding from her cheek/neck area starts as a straight thing, then forms a hook shape. This is clearly shown by the small circle at the end of the hook. It is almost like a comb shape, with teeth. It appears to be distinct from the tube opening below. Even the small vertical lines can be seen to end in a curl before the tube opening: the vertical lines within the tube aren't actually a continuation of the comb's "teeth" but look like strings attached to it that descend into the transparent tube, only obscured by the rim of the tube.
  
  The bottom end of the tube is equally weird:
  
  Here, we can see that the lines within the tube end against a vertical bar shape by her knee. This does not appear to be part of the structure beneath her, nor is it a part of the tube: the edge of the tube continues on the top side.
  It really is strange...
  ETA: Sorry if the language is confusing, and I 'm not saying that thing is an actual comb, I was just trying to describe the shape of the things the picture shows.

• RE: Another "thing" (77v)

  Koen G > 07-06-2017, 11:54 AM

  JKP: If we're going to be anachronistic I'll say it's one of those hands-free harmonicas that can be attached to the head
  
  Seriously though.. I'm not even sure if the object is supposed to be attached to the nymph at all, or if it's just there and she's kind of blowing at it?
  
  I guess one's first guess might be a comb of some kind because of the lines, but the rest of the drawing argues against that. 
  Its overall shape reminds me the most of something like a sistrum:
  
  
  
  But again this does not explain the position of the thing and the way the nymph interacts with it, since sistrums are percussion instruments.
  
  It would be important to know first whether the lines between the object and the water are supposed to be wires of some sorts or just lines indicating a flow of water...
  
  Edit: VV, our posts crossed. So you think it'ts supposed to be a tube? I hadn't looked at it that way, though I guess it might be... Keeps getting stranger indeed.

• RE: Another "thing" (77v)

  Davidsch > 07-06-2017, 12:52 PM

  I wonder, what herbs are you guys using?
  
  You do not mention 
  * the red paint that seems to come from the point where here legs are attached to the body
  * the small amount of fingers
  * the wide head and hairpiece
  * the strange eyes
  * the gently tilted left leg, as if she was kissed by a white knight
  
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• RE: Another "thing" (77v)

  VViews > 07-06-2017, 04:49 PM

  Sorry that was unclear: I don't know if it could be a tube, I was just trying to descibe the shapes that I see, and the "tube" appears to me to be distinct from the lines inside it, as I described above.
  
  But getting back to combs, here's a hypothesis: the arrangement of the "other thing"  is potentially reminiscent of some sort of wool combing situation. Notice the disposition of the combs handled by the monk below:
  
  
  You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view., 1442, You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
  Also, as Davidsch points out, the nymph's knee is raised to meet the bottom bar I highlighted, not unlike in the hausbuch picture.
  Fascinatingly, St Blaise was the patron saint of wool combers. His aid was also invoked for objects stuck in the throat.
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• RE: Another "thing" (77v)

  -JKP- > 07-06-2017, 05:02 PM

  This is the kind of bubble and bubble-maker it reminded me of:
  
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  Notice the bubble maker is open, it's not a closed ring.
  
  
  Clowns and other entertainers were far more prevalent, and very skilled (think vaudeville and circuses), before television killed most of the live-entertainment industry, so bubble-making has probably been around for quite a while. The straw style of bubble-maker was all the rage in the 17th century.
  
  I'm sure bubbles have been known for as long as soap and fingers (liquid soaps, made from oils, were in use long before solid block soaps were invented, and they are good for making bubbles), but when humans figured out how to make the big sausage-shaped bubbles, I don't know.
  
  
  
  I'm not sure what else it might be, something to scoop and sift liquids? To strain out impurities?

• RE: Another "thing" (77v)

  Koen G > 07-06-2017, 06:23 PM

  VV: Ah, indeed, a wool combing situation. This is made more likely by the possible distaff/spindle situations going on in other nymphs. It's all done in some weird Voynich way - I think the spinning references are "additional" or metaphorical.
  
  It may also be worth noting that the wool in your image has blue spots on it, not unlike the VM lines. 
  
  There's more going on though, perhaps most obviously in the arms. I am almost certain, as you are, if I remember correctly, that there is some thought and reason behind nymph poses. Her closest arm is okay but the far one is severely dislocated, even for Voynich standards.
  
  JKP: some kind of sieve is also what it looked like to me at first sight. This would imply that she is scooping into the water holding the thing in her mouth though. Like some heron or pelican. "Nymph pretending to be aquatic bird" would go well with the standing on one leg and arms like wings.
  
  
  
  

• RE: Another "thing" (77v)

  Davidsch > 09-06-2017, 01:21 PM

  contrapposto / contrapost: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
  
  Standing in contrapposto: 
  
  an asymmetrical arrangement of the human figure in which the line of the arms and shoulders contrasts with while balancing those of the hips and legs.
  The figure is artfully foreshortened, engaging in a sweeping contrapposto to provide a virtuoso ‘frame’ for the sudarium, the origin of all cult images, made without human hands from the face of Christ.
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