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f57v: A new positional confirmation

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• f57v: A new positional confirmation

• f57v: A new positional confirmation

  R. Sale > 30-12-2016, 09:22 PM

  In a recent posting, an image of the Zodiac man contained certain commentary with words such as 'cholera' and 'melancholia', in which the final letter 'a' had a significant tail underneath that much resembled the shape of the number '9'. This is also a shape that has a similarity to one of the VMs symbols, sometimes transcribed as '9', but is also found in the 4 x 17 Symbol Sequence of VMs f 57v, as Symbol #15, transcribed as EVA letter 'y'.
  
  In prior investigations of the 4 x 17 sequence, [Triple Convergence], I had suggest that there are three ways to interpret the fifth symbol of the sequence. They are 1) as the Greek letter lambda, 2) as the medieval form of the number '7', and 3) as the Roman numeral V = 5, inverted.
  
  In addition, each of these interpretations is confirmed by a form of objective placement. In the example of the fifth symbol as lambda, the first symbol of the sequence, EVA letter 'o', interpreted as the Greek letter omicron, is placed in the proper sequential relationship as it would be in the Greek alphabet, with three symbols in between, if reading Greek from right to left.
  
  Now, if one takes Symbol #15, with its various interpretations, and substitutes a potential interpretation as the letter 'a' and then takes the Greek alphabet as set down by the letters omicron and lambda, and then continues to move onward to the right through the Greek alphabet toward alpha, well, guess what? [Bingo, bango, bongo!] The count lands on Symbol #15. A new objective, position-based confirmation of the Greek alphabet interpretation.

• RE: f57v: A new positional confirmation

  -JKP- > 30-12-2016, 09:32 PM

  I agree with you that the Greek alphabet formed a partial inspiration for the shapes. I believe that the Latin alphabet did as well. Taking the two together can account for pretty much every symbol. There's really nothing unusual about them.

• RE: f57v: A new positional confirmation

  R. Sale > 30-12-2016, 10:19 PM

  JKP,
  
  
  The point is not that the appearance of the VMs symbols can be visually matched to symbols from various historical sources. The point is that the symbols from these various sources, as they are found in the 4 x 17 Symbol sequence, exist in the same spatial sequence as the letters (numbers) in the respective, historical sources.
  
  Omicron and lambda have three letters in between. Same in the VMs. Lambda and alpha have nine letters in between. Same in the VMs. So this is not simply a matter of appearance, which can be judged subjectively. It is also a matter of placement in which position can be determined objectively. It is appearance *and placement* taken together.

• RE: f57v: A new positional confirmation

  -JKP- > 31-12-2016, 01:47 AM

  (30-12-2016, 10:19 PM)R. Sale Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.JKP,
  
  
  The point is not that the appearance of the VMs symbols can be visually matched to symbols from various historical sources. The point is that the symbols from these various sources, as they are found in the 4 x 17 Symbol sequence, exist in the same spatial sequence as the letters (numbers) in the respective, historical sources.
  ...

  
  
  
  Yes, I know. I guess I should have mentioned that I've long since been aware of it. That's why I've always expressed so much confidence about it's being Latin with some Greek. As you say, the sequence confirms the visual impression.
  
  It's good that you've mentioned it though, because not everyone is familiar with the Greek alphabet (especially variations on cursive Greek) and thus would probably not be aware of this unless you had brought it up.

• RE: f57v: A new positional confirmation

  R. Sale > 31-12-2016, 09:17 PM

  IMO, we are looking at two things that haven't been clearly separated. That is because these two things were often used together in medieval illustrations. Those things are appearance and placement. They are used in conjunction to promote identification, but they are in fact separate and independent.
  
  So the first thing is appearance. This is an interesting topic and worthy of further discussion, but I'd rather move the focus to the topic of placement, which seems to be more in need of recognition. A similarity of appearance might be casual or random. The comparison of appearance between two images has a subjective component. Placement can eliminate the subjective aspect. Positioning is a statement or measurement of location. When it is possible to make a measurement of location, the comparison of placement has no subjective component. The comparison of measurable placement is objective.
  
  Therefore, when the comparison of placement is the same in a VMs sequence and in a historical sequence, it is more significant than the comparison of appearance on which it is built. To show that VMs symbols can be recognized in the symbol universe is one thing. To show that recognized symbols exist in a structure that matches the objective measurements of a known, historical, symbol structure is something else, IMO.
  
  A similarity of appearance *could* exist by chance, without ulterior meaning. A similarity of placement and measurement is much more like to be an intentional construction. Intentional construction surely implies a purpose.
  
  Given three properly placed points of contact between the VMs 4 x 17 Sequence and the Greek alphabet, [in a highly simplified and overly imaginative scenario] one *could* simply take the Greek letters and equate them with their VMs positional correspondents. This would seem to make fairly respectable, attempted system for hidden communication - if it worked. However the VMs obviously does not conform to that simple possibility. Could it really be that easy?
  
  In addition to having this correspondence with the Greek alphabet, appearance and placement in the 4 x 17 Sequence also show correspondences with the medieval numerical system, as shown on Typus Arithmetica, and with the Roman numeral system. So there are three systems of correspondence to be considered - to contend with.
  
  Is there more to be added to this??

• RE: f57v: A new positional confirmation

  -JKP- > 31-12-2016, 11:34 PM

  (31-12-2016, 09:17 PM)R. Sale Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view....
  
  In addition to having this correspondence with the Greek alphabet, appearance and placement in the 4 x 17 Sequence also show correspondences with the medieval numerical system, as shown on Typus Arithmetica, and with the Roman numeral system. So there are three systems of correspondence to be considered - to contend with.
  
  Is there more to be added to this??

  
  
  It may be worth adding that it's not a 4 x 17 sequence.  It's a 2 x 17 sequence repeated.
  
  Most of the glyph variations appear to be differences in the movement of the pen and some of the difficulty in writing in a circle, but the fact that the P shape (the less embellished one) has one loop in the first two iterations and two loops in the second two appears intentional and might be meaningful.
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