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Scorpios
#45
(31-12-2025, 10:40 PM)Aga Tentakulus wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.It is indeed a dragon.
In the constellation, either Scorpio or Serpens.
Serpens means lintworm, and lintworm also means dragon.
No constellation can exist without the stars of the other.
[..]

Interesting thread, did not see that before.
The cited answer hits it quite, this here may be a key:
[Image: 7afab5531d01cfd6bda4d4fee15a4cf2.jpg]

But I think it shows Heracles, Scorpius and Serpentarius, not a single "zodiac" sign.

These constellations are indeed neighbours:
(63/MS-724)
[Image: 0d4bbc080b09d9f30d395cdddf934175.jpg]

Another representation:
(Harley MS 1585 f017)
[Image: 4b70ee064bc657c512f60288cad82e51.jpg]

Of course, most interesting those zodiacs where Scorpio is replaced by Serpens/Dragon:
(Hunterian Psalter)
[Image: a90432c2925e35c3571c240ed7f83df9.jpg]
[Image: 82167dc7f5dc4f9260e74c816eb43359.jpg]

Coming here with a two-legged dragon having another head on his tail tip.

Within oriental zodiacs, this "serpent tail" is combined with the following zodiac Sagittarius:

[Image: 1e92434202cf7e72a8c6e4d292bbf501.jpg]
[Image: 7acff5e1a4879b919b3bd9ac74ad6a8e.jpg]
[Image: 623798ac19a24810992f7e71991b0bef.jpg]

So there is a wide spread of non-scorpion users at the Scorpius zodiac position:

[Image: 975eac78a46a22a54a7e7598320cb93e.jpg]

[Image: 0426549767ee0c78083c27b45a0c16b3.jpg]

[Image: b80e7ce34acdad61f24c287f8050aee7.jpg]

[Image: ee059146460da7d20d7ebe111aa911ed.jpg]

[Image: 3b9b9845ad7a1ba382b0caff66fb67a0.jpg]

[Image: 2589b4829984730654e126ba20a8e9f3.jpg]

[Image: 236fb8b15ca60f8d6f12f2b64cdef888.jpg]

This last one combines the old and more eastern understanding of Capricorn with a fishtail, Sagittarius as centaur and the "Scorpius" being a dragon with another head on it's tail.
And as you can see, there is no "italian"/alpine influence at all.

Showing some dragon/reptile at the Scorpius position in zodiacs may have one of the following or both reasons:

a) the draft derives from a culture where scorpions were nearly unknown to people and "dragons" considered as the more harmful species, eve if no one ever saw a dragon as well
b) the Serpentarius was the astrologically and/or astronomically more important star constellation and made it's way into the public understanding of the skies

In total, there are very few representations of Scorpius not shown by a rather precise picture of scorpions among those cultures who actually knew scorpions as a part of their life. 
Barely discussed, but most important, this excludes the dragon zodiac in the VMS from being of any italian or "alpine" origin, since scorpions are spread around the Mediterranian as well as at the east coast of Black Sea. 
And the understanding of Serpens/lindworm/dragon is obviously more located from England to northern East Europe, than in Germany: at least I never heared about some Bavarian idea of Scorpius being a reptile...
[+] 1 user says Thank You to Stefan Wirtz_2 for this post
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Messages In This Thread
Scorpios - by don of tallahassee - 02-02-2016, 04:20 PM
RE: Scorpios - by -JKP- - 02-02-2016, 05:35 PM
RE: Scorpios - by MarcoP - 02-02-2016, 06:19 PM
RE: Scorpios - by don of tallahassee - 02-02-2016, 07:12 PM
RE: Scorpios - by don of tallahassee - 02-02-2016, 09:51 PM
RE: Scorpios - by MarcoP - 03-02-2016, 12:04 PM
RE: Scorpios - by don of tallahassee - 03-02-2016, 05:27 PM
RE: Scorpios - by davidjackson - 02-02-2016, 08:02 PM
RE: Scorpios - by -JKP- - 03-02-2016, 02:51 AM
RE: Scorpios - by VViews - 02-02-2016, 10:03 PM
RE: Scorpios - by davidjackson - 03-02-2016, 05:59 PM
RE: Scorpios - by don of tallahassee - 03-02-2016, 07:39 PM
RE: Scorpios - by don of tallahassee - 03-02-2016, 08:46 PM
RE: Scorpios - by MarcoP - 04-02-2016, 09:32 AM
RE: Scorpios - by don of tallahassee - 04-02-2016, 04:05 PM
RE: Scorpios - by Diane - 06-02-2016, 09:26 AM
RE: Scorpios - by VViews - 26-06-2018, 08:55 PM
RE: Scorpios - by ReneZ - 26-06-2018, 10:00 PM
RE: Scorpios - by Koen G - 26-06-2018, 10:12 PM
RE: Scorpios - by VViews - 31-07-2019, 02:18 PM
RE: Scorpios - by VViews - 01-08-2019, 10:08 PM
RE: Scorpios - by -JKP- - 01-08-2019, 11:19 PM
RE: Scorpios - by Koen G - 01-08-2019, 11:26 PM
RE: Scorpios - by davidjackson - 02-08-2019, 04:50 PM
RE: Scorpios - by Aga Tentakulus - 20-01-2020, 12:47 PM
RE: Scorpios - by Anton - 20-01-2020, 01:18 PM
RE: Scorpios - by Koen G - 20-01-2020, 02:02 PM
RE: Scorpios - by -JKP- - 20-01-2020, 11:26 PM
RE: Scorpios - by Aga Tentakulus - 21-01-2020, 12:00 AM
RE: Scorpios - by bi3mw - 21-01-2020, 12:13 AM
RE: Scorpios - by Aga Tentakulus - 21-01-2020, 12:14 AM
RE: Scorpios - by Gioynich - 05-01-2025, 02:11 AM
RE: Scorpios - by Koen G - 05-01-2025, 10:01 AM
RE: Scorpios - by PeteClifford - 31-12-2025, 08:32 PM
RE: Scorpios - by zvijezda - 31-12-2025, 10:19 PM
RE: Scorpios - by Jorge_Stolfi - 31-12-2025, 11:13 PM
RE: Scorpios - by Koen G - 01-01-2026, 04:12 PM
RE: Scorpios - by Aga Tentakulus - 31-12-2025, 10:40 PM
RE: Scorpios - by zvijezda - 31-12-2025, 11:09 PM
RE: Scorpios - by Stefan Wirtz_2 - 01-01-2026, 04:15 PM
RE: Scorpios - by Aga Tentakulus - 31-12-2025, 10:44 PM
RE: Scorpios - by Aga Tentakulus - 01-01-2026, 01:06 AM
RE: Scorpios - by Aga Tentakulus - 01-01-2026, 08:17 AM
RE: Scorpios - by Rafal - 01-01-2026, 02:01 PM
RE: Scorpios - by Aga Tentakulus - 01-01-2026, 03:18 PM
RE: Scorpios - by R. Sale - 01-01-2026, 06:05 PM
RE: Scorpios - by Aga Tentakulus - 01-01-2026, 07:15 PM
RE: Scorpios - by Stefan Wirtz_2 - 01-01-2026, 10:57 PM
RE: Scorpios - by NosDa - 07-01-2026, 11:08 PM
RE: Scorpios - by ReneZ - 02-01-2026, 12:05 AM
RE: Scorpios - by Stefan Wirtz_2 - 03-01-2026, 02:20 PM
RE: Scorpios - by ReneZ - 04-01-2026, 01:56 AM

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