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+--- Thread: [split] f25v little dragon parallels (/thread-1401.html)
[split] f25v little dragon parallels - Koen G - 04-01-2017
(04-01-2017, 04:44 PM)Sam G Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.The sea creatures are interesting. Perhaps it's coincidental, considering that to some extent roots just look like that, but some of the proposed matches are pretty close and it would be consistent with the other obviously animal-inspired shapes in the botanical imagery.
Now, I'm definitely not saying this is a correct identification at all, but on the topic of sea creatures in the VMS, am I the only one who thinks the "dragon" on You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. looks a bit like a seahorse?
The snout, the overall body shape, and the fact that the dragon only appears to have only one "foot" are a pretty good match, though admittedly the arms are hard to explain and the foot/tail is curling the wrong way, and also it appears to be "walking" on land.
Sam: I had never thought of it as a sea horse, but they do surely share some features. I've always thought of it as a relatively late addition (i.e. outside of the plant proper) and comparable to a dragon of this "model": You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
![[Image: cc0d9095f5b6a138b595cf52e777e730.jpg]](https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/564x/cc/0d/90/cc0d9095f5b6a138b595cf52e777e730.jpg)
![[Image: d40037-33a.jpg]](http://www.bl.uk/IllImages/BLCD/mid/d400/d40037-33a.jpg)
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RE: [split] f25v little dragon parallels - Koen G - 04-01-2017
This was originally a reply to Sam in another thread, but I thought it could do with its own. Images of dragons with two legs that look somewhat like this critter can be found in medieval manuscripts. Has anyone looked for parallels before? The best I found so far is this one, another image from the same MS shown above:
RE: [split] f25v little dragon parallels - davidjackson - 04-01-2017
Is that first dragon the Pope? It's between the kings of France and Sicily, but I can't read the second word on this screen - Magnus terreus? The church protecting against the Moslem?
No idea what the Hebrew one stands for.
Dragons would later be an important alchemical symbol, usually for quicksilver. But most of the imagery I know of developed in the later Renaissance
RE: [split] f25v little dragon parallels - Koen G - 04-01-2017
The Hebrew one is the closest I've found so far. But it should be possible to find better stylistic matches still. MS is 14thC
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RE: [split] f25v little dragon parallels - Ruby Novacna - 04-01-2017
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RE: [split] f25v little dragon parallels - -JKP- - 04-01-2017
It's such an odd little critter. The head looks a bit like a bad drawing of a giraffe or alpaca, the back a bit like a sheep, a bit like a turtle. The tail looks like an extra leg. Really odd.
I wonder if the zodiac-symbol animals were mostly, sort-of, copied (or at least inspired by something) and this one was simply made up. It has a Dr. Seuss-like quality to it.
RE: [split] f25v little dragon parallels - R. Sale - 05-01-2017
The head of the VMs critter is far more like a seahorse than it is to any other illustrations. Plus it has that additional part (fin) running down the back of its neck, which is not found in any of these dragon images.
RE: [split] f25v little dragon parallels - Koen G - 05-01-2017
So maybe it was a sea horse like Sam says but copied by someone who thought it was meant to be a dragon.
RE: [split] f25v little dragon parallels - Sam G - 05-01-2017
(04-01-2017, 06:11 PM)Koen Gh. Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.Sam: I had never thought of it as a sea horse, but they do surely share some features. I've always thought of it as a relatively late addition (i.e. outside of the plant proper) and comparable to a dragon of this "model": You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
Yeah, that's kind of what I thought too, since there are dragons accompanying plants in the alchemical herbals. But it's hard to see the VMS "dragon" as being derived from any of those. Here are all the dragons from the alchemical herbal that Marco posted a while back:
Maybe it's more likely that whoever made the original alchemical herbal saw a manuscript related to the VMS, and replaced the VMS creature with a more conventional dragon.
I can see what JKP is getting at with the giraffe head and turtle shell idea. It certainly looks like it combines elements of at least two different animals. But I still think the head looks closest to that of a seahorse (which may or may not be coincidental).
RE: [split] f25v little dragon parallels - Koen G - 05-01-2017
What I find interesting about the second Hebrew Dragon I posted in post #2, is that is has a three-lobed tail, which is absent in the other examples. It also used similar patterns as the VM creature (curved parallel lines on the neck in the VM, on the back in the Hebrew).
Might the "shell" just be a folded wing? That does leave the sea horse like head and the "fin" that connects the back and the tail.