(16-03-2026, 05:34 PM)LisaFaginDavis Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.After conducting Carbon-14, collagen, MSI, and XRF testing, it is EXTREMELY unlikely that the Beinecke Library will do any additional tests. They have millions of other objects that need attention, testing, and conservation, and they are unlikely to expend more resources on the VMS anytime soon, not to mention putting it at risk by additional handling. The manuscript is very, very fragile.
I was under the impression that the samples were removed from the page, so I suppose I was hoping that those samples were maybe stored somewhere.
Or hoping that XRD was done for that specific sample at the time
(16-03-2026, 06:39 PM)eggyk Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. (16-03-2026, 05:34 PM)LisaFaginDavis Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.After conducting Carbon-14, collagen, MSI, and XRF testing, it is EXTREMELY unlikely that the Beinecke Library will do any additional tests. They have millions of other objects that need attention, testing, and conservation, and they are unlikely to expend more resources on the VMS anytime soon, not to mention putting it at risk by additional handling. The manuscript is very, very fragile.
I was under the impression that the samples were removed from the page, so I suppose I was hoping that those samples were maybe stored somewhere.
Or hoping that XRD was done for that specific sample at the time
The samples were turned over, by McCrone, to Andreas Sulzer and Klaus Steindel, (sp?), the producers of the 2009/2010 ORF documentary. They paid for these and the radiocarbon tests, so they were given the samples.
I think Mr. Barabe expressed an interest in recovering these for re-testing. However, I think it could be possible... given the number of unanswered questions, some of which have arisen since 2009... partly as a result of these very tests, in fact... that the Beinecke could be convinced of the tremendous value of new tests of various other areas, and with additional methods.
Also, various new methods of testing have been improved in the last 17 years which are even less destructive, and completely non-destructive. I think there are many reasons that anyone truly interested in knowing what the Voynich is, how old it is, and where it may have come from... all questions still unanswered... would be very interested in further testing. I know many who are, and not least among them is Barabe himself.
Rich
Believe me, I have said as much to the Beinecke curator and conservator over lunch recently, but the answer is a firm "no," at least for now. The Library has limited staff and resources, and there is a lot of concern about handling the manuscript (even if the methods of collection are non-destructive, the manuscript must still be moved to the lab, strapped down, and handled for sampling, all of which pose clear dangers to the binding, foldouts, and sewing of this fragile manuscript). They are focusing on other objects for now. I hope that perhaps someday it will be possible but it just isn't going to happen anytime soon.
Of course, whomever has the 2009 samples (if they are even still preserved, which I find doubtful) can do what they want with them.
Regarding Joseph Barabe's talk, the copper content in the ink from the text example on 26r looks to be very low, and this is consistent with text on 78r - not the whole ink test, just copper. The amounts of copper jump substantially on the painting outline ink taken from 26r, which Joseph notes as "significant". The ink again goes back to very low amounts of copper on 70v taken from the drawing of a nymph.
Might this be caused by the sample being contaminated by the green paint? There doesn't look to be any real boundary between paint and ink, so I would assume it would be a mix?
Joseph said regarding the green paint that he suspects part of the process to make the green paint was by treating copper. As you can see in the images its copper content is high.
- Thank you for the talk everyone involved, it was interesting and enjoyed listening to everyone's input.
Copper is shown "CU" in images.
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