The Voynich Ninja

I would like to show that through my method you can encode and decode a text by an untraditional cipher process, using the Zipf process.  I'm going to separate my posts so that you have to scroll down to the next one, thus making you study this little piece of text below.  I would suggest it is impossible to decode through traditional cipher mechanisms and in its form its gibberish, however it does represent meaningful text and this is the main thrust of my point of the VMS text.  The VMS text on its own is gibberish but when compared to a zipf distribution with a correct language you may discover some meaning if your analysis is correct.

Here is the text when on its own is gibberish, but it represents meaningful text.  I'm willing to bet you peek at the next reply without even decoding this.

Quote:Ytr rormo ler vnburlsie liu vgh dsaut
Ytr oper tybnaill brii lpert aerwer ytld
Voutght doedth enids vgh vordl liu dott rua gtyed
Mihty solser ytr talml fghpo wqert tergrsdf rorm
Oiurty hi liu gadfwe vgh bssofl pdert

My job for you is quite simple, refer to the Zipf distribution list below for any unknown language tokens and compare them to each known token as in English words until the little paragraph is fulfilled, then you have decoded the paragraph in a non traditional cipher method.  Each unknown token is just to the right of its English word counterpart.  This fun task will display a poetic message. This bit is from a famous poem and Poet. Have fun

When you say "Zipf distribution list", I think you're actually talking about word frequency. IE, Forbidden appears once in the English text, Tybnaill once in the obfuscated text. They both have a word frequency of one. But that doesn't mean tybnail means forbidden.
It's all good, but it doesn't mean anything.
First of all, your proposal means the Voynich would have to be a direct translation of a source text. Each word would have to appear the same number of times in each corpus. If this was so, regular patterns would be discernable and would have been picked up by now. Voynichese has word ordering that simply doesn't appear in Roman or Germanic languages (ie, LAAFU etc).
Secondly, Zipf doesn't really have anything to do with it. Zipf is a power law for distribution probability. You're just graphing the word frequency. If your graph approximates a Zipfian distribution, then you can say your text follows a Zipf distribution. But it makes no sense to change your word frequencies to make your text correspond to an arbitrary Zipfian distribution line.
And there is no such thing as a "Zipf process" to encipher text.

You're basically proposing a straight on translation from one source text to Voynichese, which is unlikely. It's an interesting idea, but I'm afraid I don't think it matches what we are seeing here.

Dear David,

I do not believe that patterns can be found for gibberish words which follow a pattern yet also retain no letter order or similar word length to other words in a text; however a copy or an original work can only be found through a Zipf Distribution if the source is found. What I should say is I don't think that there is software in our world that is powerful enough to challenge this problem! David what software is available today that can detect gibberish accurately and relay the language of an unknown text, because I would love to test it against the Voynich Manuscript?  Where is this LAAFU software?  Remember this is just a proposal and I'm not completely committed to this idea yet I appreciate the dialog, I'm thankful for your thoughts and Koens.  I wish JKP, Rene,  Emma May, Anton and Marco P would chime in too.

David no patterns would have been suspected if a gibberish text like the one I use, if used by the Author of the Voynich text was used.  This Author probably made a personal notebook that never gained notoriety.  This could be the original work of someone,  which he only knew the content and he possessed the separate list.

The unknown language I created does not retain any order whatsoever it is mere gibberish, it rarely matches word length nor letter order.  The only way possible to decode it David was Via a Zipf distribution.  Your welcome to check the url where I accessed the python code and it is named after Zipf for the python code.


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I agree with David J.

(30-09-2020, 10:33 PM)Voynichgibberish Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.then you have decoded the paragraph in a non traditional cipher method

You gave the meaning of the last line and Google did the rest for me to find the famous poem. But if you don't have this list, how will you proceed to decipher your own text? Let's assume that the language and the subject of the content are unknown to us.

(08-10-2020, 07:16 AM)ReneZ Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.I agree with David J.

Dear Rene,

According to David, how do we determine word ordering for the Voynich Manuscript?  Is there a software package which can show this?  And if there is do you know of one in python?

I can only advise to read up as much as possible on the work that has been done before.
After that, one is in a better position to decide which way to go.

(08-10-2020, 06:06 PM)ReneZ Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.I can only advise to read up as much as possible on the work that has been done before.
After that, one is in a better position to decide which way to go.

This is a very vague answer on the account that you agree with David.  You should counter with a valid argument for your agreement.

(08-10-2020, 06:08 AM)Voynichgibberish Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.This Author probably made a personal notebook that never gained notoriety.  This could be the original work of someone,  which he only knew the content and he possessed the separate list.

But you started off suggesting in post 1:

Quote:The VMS is a copy of several books from the Latin Vulgate Bible:

Yet in scrambled form

Which is it?

Anyway.
Your proposal only makes sense if you have two texts with identical word frequency. You draw up a Zipf graph, overlay them, and see if they correspond identically.
But even this doesn't make sense - a word for word translation from,ie, English to Spanish, won't have identical word frequencies.
For example:

Padre Nuestro, que estás en el cielo, santificado sea tu nombre; venga a nosotros tu reino; hágase tu voluntad, en la tierra como en el cielo.

Our Father, who art in heaven, hallowed be thy name; thy kingdom come; thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven.

Two identical and very sacred texts, very different word frequencies, but identical meanings.