<![CDATA[The Voynich Ninja - Portal]]> https://www.voynich.ninja/ Fri, 09 Oct 2026 14:51:13 +0000 MyBB <![CDATA[A match for the containers? 16th-17th century ivory vases]]> https://www.voynich.ninja/thread-6174.html Wed, 07 Oct 2026 20:16:43 +0000 JustAnotherTheory]]> https://www.voynich.ninja/thread-6174.html

.png   01.png (Size: 637.92 KB / Downloads: 202)

It appears to me that these ivory objects ressemble the containers in the VMS. Many of these, and indeed others in 16th-17th century ivory vase collections from Italy and South Germany, appear to bear close parallels to the VMS. Note that ivory working was not established before the 16th century.


.png   02.png (Size: 534.03 KB / Downloads: 202)


.png   19.png (Size: 320.12 KB / Downloads: 201)


.png   assortment.png (Size: 452.58 KB / Downloads: 202)

Now take a look at Rudolf II's collection.


.png   rud.png (Size: 222.82 KB / Downloads: 204)


.png   rud2.png (Size: 260.83 KB / Downloads: 202)

Again, please note that ivory working began after 1500.]]>

.png   01.png (Size: 637.92 KB / Downloads: 202)

It appears to me that these ivory objects ressemble the containers in the VMS. Many of these, and indeed others in 16th-17th century ivory vase collections from Italy and South Germany, appear to bear close parallels to the VMS. Note that ivory working was not established before the 16th century.


.png   02.png (Size: 534.03 KB / Downloads: 202)


.png   19.png (Size: 320.12 KB / Downloads: 201)


.png   assortment.png (Size: 452.58 KB / Downloads: 202)

Now take a look at Rudolf II's collection.


.png   rud.png (Size: 222.82 KB / Downloads: 204)


.png   rud2.png (Size: 260.83 KB / Downloads: 202)

Again, please note that ivory working began after 1500.]]> <![CDATA[eva-m on f3/f6]]> https://www.voynich.ninja/thread-6172.html Wed, 07 Oct 2026 08:19:23 +0000 Skoove]]> https://www.voynich.ninja/thread-6172.html
I'm not sure if this helps us figure out what this glyph actually is but it almost looks the scribe was testing it out or had some other reason to use it over and over again specifically here. 

Also of interest is that it is used non line-final in multiple places in these pages.

For those who don't believe that 'm' is an line-final positional glyph (i.e. it doesn't encode for any information) or those who don't believe it to be an abbreviation for 'iin' what other theories are out there (that don't just say that it is meaningless)?]]>
I'm not sure if this helps us figure out what this glyph actually is but it almost looks the scribe was testing it out or had some other reason to use it over and over again specifically here. 

Also of interest is that it is used non line-final in multiple places in these pages.

For those who don't believe that 'm' is an line-final positional glyph (i.e. it doesn't encode for any information) or those who don't believe it to be an abbreviation for 'iin' what other theories are out there (that don't just say that it is meaningless)?]]> <![CDATA[Youtube channel on castle design]]> https://www.voynich.ninja/thread-6170.html Tue, 06 Oct 2026 21:17:16 +0000 Bluetoes101]]> https://www.voynich.ninja/thread-6170.html
Video in question - You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
Channel - You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.]]>
Video in question - You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
Channel - You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.]]> <![CDATA[Trying to find an image someone posted that looks a lot like f75r?]]> https://www.voynich.ninja/thread-6169.html Tue, 06 Oct 2026 08:39:33 +0000 gerrydelasel]]> https://www.voynich.ninja/thread-6169.html
.jpg   Trinity.O.2.48.jpg (Size: 90.17 KB / Downloads: 145) ]]>
.jpg   Trinity.O.2.48.jpg (Size: 90.17 KB / Downloads: 145) ]]> <![CDATA[[split] Taccola spillover thread]]> https://www.voynich.ninja/thread-6176.html Tue, 06 Oct 2026 04:25:57 +0000 JustAnotherTheory]]> https://www.voynich.ninja/thread-6176.html
I see no point in having to copy two images from a personal sketchbook. If some some reason that sketchbook is important; then why did the artist not copy more pictures, like tens, or more? Why just 2?

It makes no sense. Unless you're a relative of Taccola and have eyes on his manuscript every day.

Otherwise, why not just go to the library and take one of the many engineering books, or Konrad Kyeser instead?

_______________________________________

Edit KG: I am hijacking the first post to add this overview of Taccola-related MSS by Ed:

(Yesterday, 06:43 PM)DG97EEB Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.TACCOLA — AUTOGRAPHS
- Munich, BSB Clm 197,II — De ingeneis I–II + "Notebook" (c.1419–c.1450; KdiH gives 1441) — You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
- Florence, BNCF Palatino 766 — De ingeneis III–IV, dedicated to Sigismund (c.1431–1433) — You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
- Munich, BSB Clm 28800 — De machinis (completed 1449) — You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
COPIES OF DE MACHINIS
- Paris, BnF lat. 7239 — Paolo Santini copy (1459?, Venice; before 1475) — You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
- New York Public Library, Spencer Coll. MS 136 ("Codex Wilczek II") — 15th-c. copy, exact date not established — You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
- Venice, Marciana Lat. VIII, 40 (=2941) — later excerpts, date not established — You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
DERIVATIVE COMPILATIONS
- London, BL Add MS 34113 — excerpts from De ingeneis, De machinis and Francesco di Giorgio's Codicetto (2nd half 15th c.; additions dated 1612) — You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
- Dresden, SLUB — military-technical miscellany with drawings after Taccola, Valturio, Francesco di Giorgio (c.1440–1460, per Handschriftenportal) — You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
RELATED
- Vatican, BAV Urb. lat. 1757 — Francesco di Giorgio, Codicetto, free copies after Taccola (c.1465–1470/76) — You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
- Florence, BNCF Palatino 767 — later excerpts (date not established) — no link
]]>
I see no point in having to copy two images from a personal sketchbook. If some some reason that sketchbook is important; then why did the artist not copy more pictures, like tens, or more? Why just 2?

It makes no sense. Unless you're a relative of Taccola and have eyes on his manuscript every day.

Otherwise, why not just go to the library and take one of the many engineering books, or Konrad Kyeser instead?

_______________________________________

Edit KG: I am hijacking the first post to add this overview of Taccola-related MSS by Ed:

(Yesterday, 06:43 PM)DG97EEB Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.TACCOLA — AUTOGRAPHS
- Munich, BSB Clm 197,II — De ingeneis I–II + "Notebook" (c.1419–c.1450; KdiH gives 1441) — You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
- Florence, BNCF Palatino 766 — De ingeneis III–IV, dedicated to Sigismund (c.1431–1433) — You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
- Munich, BSB Clm 28800 — De machinis (completed 1449) — You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
COPIES OF DE MACHINIS
- Paris, BnF lat. 7239 — Paolo Santini copy (1459?, Venice; before 1475) — You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
- New York Public Library, Spencer Coll. MS 136 ("Codex Wilczek II") — 15th-c. copy, exact date not established — You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
- Venice, Marciana Lat. VIII, 40 (=2941) — later excerpts, date not established — You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
DERIVATIVE COMPILATIONS
- London, BL Add MS 34113 — excerpts from De ingeneis, De machinis and Francesco di Giorgio's Codicetto (2nd half 15th c.; additions dated 1612) — You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
- Dresden, SLUB — military-technical miscellany with drawings after Taccola, Valturio, Francesco di Giorgio (c.1440–1460, per Handschriftenportal) — You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
RELATED
- Vatican, BAV Urb. lat. 1757 — Francesco di Giorgio, Codicetto, free copies after Taccola (c.1465–1470/76) — You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
- Florence, BNCF Palatino 767 — later excerpts (date not established) — no link
]]> <![CDATA[Ungrammatical repetition of the same few words]]> https://www.voynich.ninja/thread-6167.html Mon, 05 Oct 2026 19:12:56 +0000 punainerkarhu]]> https://www.voynich.ninja/thread-6167.html
But what if the author/s of the manuscript generated the text by repeating the same words (throwing in a few more rare words here and there) over and over again with no grammar just substituting the letters/sounds in their native language with new glyphs they invented? Basically simple substitution just no real meaning behind the text. 

Personally I don't think that's the case but could be worth considering as it might explain some properties of the manuscript, and I wanted to check if a similar idea was discussed before and whether someone tried mapping Voynich words to existing languages to see if some substitutions provide consistent results.]]>
But what if the author/s of the manuscript generated the text by repeating the same words (throwing in a few more rare words here and there) over and over again with no grammar just substituting the letters/sounds in their native language with new glyphs they invented? Basically simple substitution just no real meaning behind the text. 

Personally I don't think that's the case but could be worth considering as it might explain some properties of the manuscript, and I wanted to check if a similar idea was discussed before and whether someone tried mapping Voynich words to existing languages to see if some substitutions provide consistent results.]]> <![CDATA[What do other herbals actually talk about? Here's an example.]]> https://www.voynich.ninja/thread-6164.html Mon, 05 Oct 2026 12:55:55 +0000 gerrydelasel]]> https://www.voynich.ninja/thread-6164.html
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. is a good example from the 14th century. On page 66r & 66v we find the castor oil plant, which is quite similar to Voynich You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view..

.jpg   Trinity.O.2.48.jpg (Size: 69.28 KB / Downloads: 213)  
.jpg   VOM_f6v.jpg (Size: 86.25 KB / Downloads: 213)

Here is my transcription of the Latin. If you can fill in any of the gaps, please let me know!

.jpg   Trinity.O.2.48latin.jpg (Size: 166.36 KB / Downloads: 220)

And here is the English translation:

1. Herb name: Pentadatillus; others call it Palma Christi, others Castos Oro guardian of the garden, others
2. Priapiscus, and others Girasol; the Greeks call it Tebeet, and the Gauls call it Perga Major. Herb grows
3. in gardens, fields, and mountains, similar to hellebore. Herb has broad leaves,
4. split like a wild fig tree, and it bears a certain round pod like wild burdock.
5. In this small pod, something is enclosed that resembles a certain worm,
6. common name: cetha. This herb is called Girasol because its leaves turn
7. according to the turning of the sun; just as the sun beams brightly, so these leaves turn themselves with the sun. The flower
8. does the same. The crushed seed of this plant's black pods, when drunk with wine,
9. warm, relieves [indecipherable]. [Indecipherable] is spherical, and [indecipherable]
10. madness, and when eaten it is beneficial against bloating/flatulence, which it solves. Likewise, its seed gives
11. the virtue of walking invisibly, according to what is found in Dioscorides, who
12. says expressly: 'Take nine seeds of this herb during the harvest, and plant them
13. inside the head of a black [indecipherable], and place it in the earth.'
14. And [he says words over the seeds] so that he may know that
15. in the name of the Father he will be seen by no one. This herb must obey.
16. It is to be gathered in October; crescent moon. And while you are gathering it,
17. be clean and wash your hands, feet, and face with clean holy water.
18. And when you gather it, say this prayer: '[Indecipherable], O herb,
19. by the great name of the Lord Atah Gibor Leolam Adonai, and by Blessed Mary, and
20. by the virtues through which God created heaven, earth, the sea, and all things that are in them,
21. and by the saints of heaven and earth: O Lord God of Hosts,
22. hear my prayer, so that you may grant to this herb power and victory, that it may be of help
23. to me in any of my needs.' Say the Lord's prayer.]]>
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. is a good example from the 14th century. On page 66r & 66v we find the castor oil plant, which is quite similar to Voynich You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view..

.jpg   Trinity.O.2.48.jpg (Size: 69.28 KB / Downloads: 213)  
.jpg   VOM_f6v.jpg (Size: 86.25 KB / Downloads: 213)

Here is my transcription of the Latin. If you can fill in any of the gaps, please let me know!

.jpg   Trinity.O.2.48latin.jpg (Size: 166.36 KB / Downloads: 220)

And here is the English translation:

1. Herb name: Pentadatillus; others call it Palma Christi, others Castos Oro guardian of the garden, others
2. Priapiscus, and others Girasol; the Greeks call it Tebeet, and the Gauls call it Perga Major. Herb grows
3. in gardens, fields, and mountains, similar to hellebore. Herb has broad leaves,
4. split like a wild fig tree, and it bears a certain round pod like wild burdock.
5. In this small pod, something is enclosed that resembles a certain worm,
6. common name: cetha. This herb is called Girasol because its leaves turn
7. according to the turning of the sun; just as the sun beams brightly, so these leaves turn themselves with the sun. The flower
8. does the same. The crushed seed of this plant's black pods, when drunk with wine,
9. warm, relieves [indecipherable]. [Indecipherable] is spherical, and [indecipherable]
10. madness, and when eaten it is beneficial against bloating/flatulence, which it solves. Likewise, its seed gives
11. the virtue of walking invisibly, according to what is found in Dioscorides, who
12. says expressly: 'Take nine seeds of this herb during the harvest, and plant them
13. inside the head of a black [indecipherable], and place it in the earth.'
14. And [he says words over the seeds] so that he may know that
15. in the name of the Father he will be seen by no one. This herb must obey.
16. It is to be gathered in October; crescent moon. And while you are gathering it,
17. be clean and wash your hands, feet, and face with clean holy water.
18. And when you gather it, say this prayer: '[Indecipherable], O herb,
19. by the great name of the Lord Atah Gibor Leolam Adonai, and by Blessed Mary, and
20. by the virtues through which God created heaven, earth, the sea, and all things that are in them,
21. and by the saints of heaven and earth: O Lord God of Hosts,
22. hear my prayer, so that you may grant to this herb power and victory, that it may be of help
23. to me in any of my needs.' Say the Lord's prayer.]]> <![CDATA[F80r - Leprosy in La Franceschina 1474]]> https://www.voynich.ninja/thread-6162.html Sun, 04 Oct 2026 21:30:19 +0000 Bluetoes101]]> https://www.voynich.ninja/thread-6162.html Register or Login to view. maybe resembling "clappers", and there was a bit of discussion about it. 

What caught my eye is the monk(?)/healer using tongues/forceps on the person in the bed above the person with the clappers in the lower down bed. There is also another person with them sitting to the left. 

I don't have much to add, I just thought it was an interesting comparison that may incorporate both objects in this section of You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. and leprosy/clappers previously discussed. 


.jpg   slp.JPG (Size: 286.97 KB / Downloads: 172)


Links to image
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.

Books is here - Image on 223r
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.]]> Register or Login to view. maybe resembling "clappers", and there was a bit of discussion about it. 

What caught my eye is the monk(?)/healer using tongues/forceps on the person in the bed above the person with the clappers in the lower down bed. There is also another person with them sitting to the left. 

I don't have much to add, I just thought it was an interesting comparison that may incorporate both objects in this section of You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. and leprosy/clappers previously discussed. 


.jpg   slp.JPG (Size: 286.97 KB / Downloads: 172)


Links to image
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.

Books is here - Image on 223r
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.]]> <![CDATA[Independent structural comparison: Functional Decoding Model and mechanical matrix mo]]> https://www.voynich.ninja/thread-6157.html Sun, 04 Oct 2026 08:23:26 +0000 jerrykess]]> https://www.voynich.ninja/thread-6157.html Tobias Franke's "Functional Decoding Model" approaches the manuscript from a semantic-functional perspective, while my experimental model approaches it from the opposite direction: as a rule-based mechanical generation system, without assuming a translation or semantic meaning.
The comparison examines whether structures identified independently by the two approaches correspond to each other, including recurring word families, positional patterns and permitted transitions.
My model currently uses 19 states and 87 permitted transitions. In page-wise cross-validation it covered 92.84% of observed Voynich transitions, compared with 67.63% for a Latin control corpus under the same procedure.
I do not consider this a decipherment or proof of a historical mechanism. The purpose of the model is to formulate a testable and falsifiable hypothesis about how some of the manuscript's textual regularities might have been generated.

You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.

You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.

I would especially welcome criticism of the methodology and suggestions for independent tests.]]> Tobias Franke's "Functional Decoding Model" approaches the manuscript from a semantic-functional perspective, while my experimental model approaches it from the opposite direction: as a rule-based mechanical generation system, without assuming a translation or semantic meaning.
The comparison examines whether structures identified independently by the two approaches correspond to each other, including recurring word families, positional patterns and permitted transitions.
My model currently uses 19 states and 87 permitted transitions. In page-wise cross-validation it covered 92.84% of observed Voynich transitions, compared with 67.63% for a Latin control corpus under the same procedure.
I do not consider this a decipherment or proof of a historical mechanism. The purpose of the model is to formulate a testable and falsifiable hypothesis about how some of the manuscript's textual regularities might have been generated.

You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.

You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.

I would especially welcome criticism of the methodology and suggestions for independent tests.]]> <![CDATA[VM as a medieval design guide]]> https://www.voynich.ninja/thread-6156.html Sat, 03 Oct 2026 23:52:52 +0000 drom_is]]> https://www.voynich.ninja/thread-6156.html
What if the VM is actually a medieval design guide on how to draw plausible illustrations for fantasy manuscripts?
As such, it could explain the content of botanical and astronomy sections.
Also it could explain its language, because it’s not a plain text but mostly a set of instructions how to produce illustrations from the same page.
I’ve asked ChatGPT and it found me the similar example of the same age: Göttingen Model Book (c. 1440). It is a book about generative drawing of ornaments.

Then, there is more elaborated, but more speculative idea, that explains why it’s encrypted. So the idea is, that it’s an internal handbook of highly skilled individual, who has created the fake manuscripts with ancient mysteries. As far as i know the 15th century saw a great interest in ancient books and also there are examples of such manuscripts. And to produce consistent mysteries over time someone had to record his ideas somewhere, but he obviously didn’t want for someone to uncover him, therefore the text is encrypted. This also explains why it is so hard to decipher, because private notes would contain some abbreviations, missing words, private terminology etc.

This idea could be tested, i guess, as similar plant illustrations should have similar text nearby, but i’m not technically skilled for that.

I hope I didn’t come with something that was discussed long ago and then discarded.]]>
What if the VM is actually a medieval design guide on how to draw plausible illustrations for fantasy manuscripts?
As such, it could explain the content of botanical and astronomy sections.
Also it could explain its language, because it’s not a plain text but mostly a set of instructions how to produce illustrations from the same page.
I’ve asked ChatGPT and it found me the similar example of the same age: Göttingen Model Book (c. 1440). It is a book about generative drawing of ornaments.

Then, there is more elaborated, but more speculative idea, that explains why it’s encrypted. So the idea is, that it’s an internal handbook of highly skilled individual, who has created the fake manuscripts with ancient mysteries. As far as i know the 15th century saw a great interest in ancient books and also there are examples of such manuscripts. And to produce consistent mysteries over time someone had to record his ideas somewhere, but he obviously didn’t want for someone to uncover him, therefore the text is encrypted. This also explains why it is so hard to decipher, because private notes would contain some abbreviations, missing words, private terminology etc.

This idea could be tested, i guess, as similar plant illustrations should have similar text nearby, but i’m not technically skilled for that.

I hope I didn’t come with something that was discussed long ago and then discarded.]]>