<![CDATA[The Voynich Ninja - Imagery]]> https://www.voynich.ninja/ Mon, 02 Nov 2026 00:07:21 +0000 MyBB <![CDATA[Unknown plants and bathing nymphs... Chantilly MS 653]]> https://www.voynich.ninja/thread-6243.html Sat, 24 Oct 2026 18:56:35 +0000 JustAnotherTheory]]> https://www.voynich.ninja/thread-6243.html
  • Unknown or fictional plants,
  • A number of nymphs bathing inside and outside of a cave,
  • Banned books,
  • People of interest from different countries,
  • Northern Italy.

So, basically, in the early 15th century in a North Italian village called Montemonaco, something unusual was taking place. According to several eyewitness accounts, up in the nearby mountains, knights from several European countries were gathering to take place in an occult ritual nearby two lakes, at the opening of a cave called "the cave of the Queen Sibylla". They met under the cover of night, and consecrated several banned and alchemical books. It turns out that the villagers helped them, sheltered them, gave them food, because it meant additional income. When the Church got hold of these events, it excommunicated the entire village of Montemonaco. 

One of the best first-hand eyewitness accounts comes from a certain Antoine de la Sale, who described the rituals in what is today the manuscript Chantilly MS 653 (link to online scans You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view., although the website is down since the PHP issues 2 days ago).

It seems that the surroundings of Montemonaco have many "unknown" plants with special properties. Here is one, called the Chentofollie, directly from the Chatilly MS, compared to a plant in the Voynich MS:


.png   666.png (Size: 1.54 MB / Downloads: 217)

Another plant, the Pollibastro, again totally unknown in traditional herbals, is featured in this MS:


.png   777.png (Size: 467.68 KB / Downloads: 219)

I found no equivalent in the VMS. However, the name "Pollibastro" reminds me of one of the plant names in the obscure MS from Trinity College O2.48. Could there be a connection?

Now on to the nymphs. It seems that on this mountain, there is an entrance to a cave that houses the many nymphs of the Queen Sibylla, who enjoy bathing naked in nearby lakes. These lakes are quite interesting, because in wet season, they form one single lake, but in dry season, they from several:


.png   888.png (Size: 285.08 KB / Downloads: 219)

It kind of looks like the lakes from the VMS Quire 13 that are connected to each other via a canal. The nymphs would traditionally come out of the caves, transform into serpents, and bathe in these lakes.


.png   999.png (Size: 708.28 KB / Downloads: 220)


It is said that knights would come from as far as Spain to partake in rituals atop this mountain, venerating the nymphs and consecrating banned books. This is all documented in detail when the Inquisition literally excommunicated the entire village when they got wind of the rituals that were happening there.
_______________________________________________

Here is a scholarly article about this: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.

The Wikipedia entry: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.]]>
  • Unknown or fictional plants,
  • A number of nymphs bathing inside and outside of a cave,
  • Banned books,
  • People of interest from different countries,
  • Northern Italy.

So, basically, in the early 15th century in a North Italian village called Montemonaco, something unusual was taking place. According to several eyewitness accounts, up in the nearby mountains, knights from several European countries were gathering to take place in an occult ritual nearby two lakes, at the opening of a cave called "the cave of the Queen Sibylla". They met under the cover of night, and consecrated several banned and alchemical books. It turns out that the villagers helped them, sheltered them, gave them food, because it meant additional income. When the Church got hold of these events, it excommunicated the entire village of Montemonaco. 

One of the best first-hand eyewitness accounts comes from a certain Antoine de la Sale, who described the rituals in what is today the manuscript Chantilly MS 653 (link to online scans You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view., although the website is down since the PHP issues 2 days ago).

It seems that the surroundings of Montemonaco have many "unknown" plants with special properties. Here is one, called the Chentofollie, directly from the Chatilly MS, compared to a plant in the Voynich MS:


.png   666.png (Size: 1.54 MB / Downloads: 217)

Another plant, the Pollibastro, again totally unknown in traditional herbals, is featured in this MS:


.png   777.png (Size: 467.68 KB / Downloads: 219)

I found no equivalent in the VMS. However, the name "Pollibastro" reminds me of one of the plant names in the obscure MS from Trinity College O2.48. Could there be a connection?

Now on to the nymphs. It seems that on this mountain, there is an entrance to a cave that houses the many nymphs of the Queen Sibylla, who enjoy bathing naked in nearby lakes. These lakes are quite interesting, because in wet season, they form one single lake, but in dry season, they from several:


.png   888.png (Size: 285.08 KB / Downloads: 219)

It kind of looks like the lakes from the VMS Quire 13 that are connected to each other via a canal. The nymphs would traditionally come out of the caves, transform into serpents, and bathe in these lakes.


.png   999.png (Size: 708.28 KB / Downloads: 220)


It is said that knights would come from as far as Spain to partake in rituals atop this mountain, venerating the nymphs and consecrating banned books. This is all documented in detail when the Inquisition literally excommunicated the entire village when they got wind of the rituals that were happening there.
_______________________________________________

Here is a scholarly article about this: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.

The Wikipedia entry: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.]]> <![CDATA[[split] f68r1 - circles with moon, sun and stars/planets]]> https://www.voynich.ninja/thread-6242.html Fri, 23 Oct 2026 07:39:40 +0000 DG97EEB]]> https://www.voynich.ninja/thread-6242.html You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.

.jpg   10B86F21_jpg_8.jpg (Size: 3.24 KB / Downloads: 208)

.jpg   10B86F21_jpg_20.jpg (Size: 3.01 KB / Downloads: 209)

.jpg   10B86F21_jpg_32.jpg (Size: 2.99 KB / Downloads: 208)

.jpg   10B86F21_jpg_25.jpg (Size: 3.28 KB / Downloads: 208)

.jpg   10B86F21_jpg_22.jpg (Size: 3.04 KB / Downloads: 208)

.png   Screenshot_20261023-091415.png (Size: 1.16 MB / Downloads: 199)

.jpg   10B86F21_jpg_8 (1).jpg (Size: 104.39 KB / Downloads: 199) ]]> You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.

.jpg   10B86F21_jpg_8.jpg (Size: 3.24 KB / Downloads: 208)

.jpg   10B86F21_jpg_20.jpg (Size: 3.01 KB / Downloads: 209)

.jpg   10B86F21_jpg_32.jpg (Size: 2.99 KB / Downloads: 208)

.jpg   10B86F21_jpg_25.jpg (Size: 3.28 KB / Downloads: 208)

.jpg   10B86F21_jpg_22.jpg (Size: 3.04 KB / Downloads: 208)

.png   Screenshot_20261023-091415.png (Size: 1.16 MB / Downloads: 199)

.jpg   10B86F21_jpg_8 (1).jpg (Size: 104.39 KB / Downloads: 199) ]]> <![CDATA[Holding stars]]> https://www.voynich.ninja/thread-6222.html Mon, 19 Oct 2026 18:04:05 +0000 R. Sale]]> https://www.voynich.ninja/thread-6222.html Register or Login to view.

Planets holding planets.]]> Register or Login to view.

Planets holding planets.]]> <![CDATA[Boticelli - Venus and Mars on f66r?]]> https://www.voynich.ninja/thread-6217.html Sat, 17 Oct 2026 06:31:25 +0000 JustAnotherTheory]]> https://www.voynich.ninja/thread-6217.html

.png   1.png (Size: 283.77 KB / Downloads: 83)

It's called "Venus and Mars".

Now look at VMS folio 66r, on the bottom of the page:


.png   boti.png (Size: 806.34 KB / Downloads: 83)

The annotations next to the person are also strangely reminiscent of the words "Venus" and "Mars":


.png   boti2.png (Size: 291.65 KB / Downloads: 84) ]]>

.png   1.png (Size: 283.77 KB / Downloads: 83)

It's called "Venus and Mars".

Now look at VMS folio 66r, on the bottom of the page:


.png   boti.png (Size: 806.34 KB / Downloads: 83)

The annotations next to the person are also strangely reminiscent of the words "Venus" and "Mars":


.png   boti2.png (Size: 291.65 KB / Downloads: 84) ]]> <![CDATA[Wien Cod. 13647]]> https://www.voynich.ninja/thread-6183.html Sun, 11 Oct 2026 09:55:02 +0000 JustAnotherTheory]]> https://www.voynich.ninja/thread-6183.html

.png   cancer.png (Size: 215.11 KB / Downloads: 215) [url=https://www.handschriftencensus.de/hss/Wien][/url]

There are other similarities to the VMS too:


.png   gemini.png (Size: 224.17 KB / Downloads: 216)


.png   mermaid.png (Size: 308.08 KB / Downloads: 216)


.png   pisces.png (Size: 176.37 KB / Downloads: 216)

Links to the MS:

You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.

You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.]]>

.png   cancer.png (Size: 215.11 KB / Downloads: 215) [url=https://www.handschriftencensus.de/hss/Wien][/url]

There are other similarities to the VMS too:


.png   gemini.png (Size: 224.17 KB / Downloads: 216)


.png   mermaid.png (Size: 308.08 KB / Downloads: 216)


.png   pisces.png (Size: 176.37 KB / Downloads: 216)

Links to the MS:

You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.

You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.]]> <![CDATA[f86v3 - The birds and the.. spices?]]> https://www.voynich.ninja/thread-6178.html Fri, 09 Oct 2026 20:17:39 +0000 Bluetoes101]]> https://www.voynich.ninja/thread-6178.html Much of it is also probably just from a couple of influential names from antiquity saying stuff and it being repeated forever.

In the case of cinnamon "forever" ended around 1505 when a Portuguese ship was chasing a spice merchants ship,
got lost and found themselves on the shores of Sri Lanka (as a story goes), from there they figured it out and took over.

Whether tastes just changed, or cinnamon lost its mystique, this marked a point where the popularity of cinnamon in Europe
would start on a downward trajectory. Maybe it just didn't taste as good when it wasn't harvested from the nest of the legendary "Cinnamologus"!

You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.

Please read the above for a comprihensive overview, but the "TLDR" (Too Lazy Didn't Read) is as follows.
It is worth noting I have read several conflicting things about what Pliny the Elder said, but I'm going to stick to this source.

- Herodotus. Great birds take the sticks (cinnamon) to nests built of mud on the mountain crags. Men left large bits of meat for them,
once back in the nest the weight would break it, once at the bottom men would take the cinnamon.

- Aristotle. The cinnamon bird makes a nest of cinnamon (both things from an unknown place) in very tall trees. The natives dip arrow heads
in iron which destroy the nest, then they can pick up the cinnamon.

- Pliny the Elder. Agrees with Aristotle but now gives it a name "a bird called Cinnamologus".

- Aelianus. "Cinnamologus" is now "Cinnamomus" and the story becomes a mix - The bird fetches twigs from the ends of the earth. And builds
a nest among sheer crags (the tree is gone). People shoot heavy arrows from a bow strained to its utmost, this shatters them and they fall down.

- Gaius Julius Solinus. Cinnamologus (we are back to this now) weaves a nest from cinnamon fruits ( ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ ). People shoot leaden darts at the nest.

- Isidore of Seville. Cinnamologus makes a nest in tall trees. People use lead-weighted missiles to dislodge the nest.

Jumping from 7CE to 13CE

- Thomas of Cantimpré. Cynamologus builds nest in the highest trees. People shoot it with leaded arrows to drop down Cinnamon.

So what the manuscripts of the middle ages show is people shooting down the nest from a tree with arrows, presumably from a bow. Right?
That would be too easy!


.jpg   ex.JPG (Size: 65.16 KB / Downloads: 138)

The slingshot does seem to be quite a popular adaptation, however there are many variations that achieve the same message overall. 


.jpg   bir.JPG (Size: 77.25 KB / Downloads: 137)

The mountain crag/cliff part of the story seems to not be as popular. At least I haven't found examples. 
Personally I had taken the VMS images to show mountain/cliff - However Rene notes "The two at the bottom are a bit larger and appear to have some elements of flowers." You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.

If you look at the examples above and the ones here You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view., you will note many of the trees are more "plant-like" than "tree-like".. but either way, I think its safe to say the VMS drawing is ambiguous and mountain/big plant.. things, might be in the ballpark. 

Reading the image counter clock-wise, 

Person (seems like a man) with a round thing in hand, on cliff/plant.. thing
I flipped this image just to show the hand better
 

.jpg   cliff1.JPG (Size: 73.36 KB / Downloads: 143)

Person (seems like a man) with movement lines shooting up from hand (throwing/shooting/projectile..ing?)


.jpg   cliff2.JPG (Size: 55.53 KB / Downloads: 143)

Bird seemingly on a nest (Speculatively, I have wondered if the circles with lines coming down to nest are balls hitting it)


.jpg   cliff3.JPG (Size: 44.41 KB / Downloads: 142)

Bird is flying/falling, a bunch of stuff falls down, so far that it goes through the text. 


.jpg   cliff4.JPG (Size: 67.72 KB / Downloads: 142)

Might I have a story of the Cinnamologus?

On researching the fancy containers starting on You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. my feeling currently is that they are containers for spice, and other valuable ingredients. They also appear in the middle of the ROS (the other side of f86v3). If my hunch is right, a story about the origins of Cinnamon planted in the middle doesn't seem out of place.

Sorry for a wall of text, hopefully it wasn't too boring. I'd like to hear what you think.]]> Much of it is also probably just from a couple of influential names from antiquity saying stuff and it being repeated forever.

In the case of cinnamon "forever" ended around 1505 when a Portuguese ship was chasing a spice merchants ship,
got lost and found themselves on the shores of Sri Lanka (as a story goes), from there they figured it out and took over.

Whether tastes just changed, or cinnamon lost its mystique, this marked a point where the popularity of cinnamon in Europe
would start on a downward trajectory. Maybe it just didn't taste as good when it wasn't harvested from the nest of the legendary "Cinnamologus"!

You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.

Please read the above for a comprihensive overview, but the "TLDR" (Too Lazy Didn't Read) is as follows.
It is worth noting I have read several conflicting things about what Pliny the Elder said, but I'm going to stick to this source.

- Herodotus. Great birds take the sticks (cinnamon) to nests built of mud on the mountain crags. Men left large bits of meat for them,
once back in the nest the weight would break it, once at the bottom men would take the cinnamon.

- Aristotle. The cinnamon bird makes a nest of cinnamon (both things from an unknown place) in very tall trees. The natives dip arrow heads
in iron which destroy the nest, then they can pick up the cinnamon.

- Pliny the Elder. Agrees with Aristotle but now gives it a name "a bird called Cinnamologus".

- Aelianus. "Cinnamologus" is now "Cinnamomus" and the story becomes a mix - The bird fetches twigs from the ends of the earth. And builds
a nest among sheer crags (the tree is gone). People shoot heavy arrows from a bow strained to its utmost, this shatters them and they fall down.

- Gaius Julius Solinus. Cinnamologus (we are back to this now) weaves a nest from cinnamon fruits ( ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ ). People shoot leaden darts at the nest.

- Isidore of Seville. Cinnamologus makes a nest in tall trees. People use lead-weighted missiles to dislodge the nest.

Jumping from 7CE to 13CE

- Thomas of Cantimpré. Cynamologus builds nest in the highest trees. People shoot it with leaded arrows to drop down Cinnamon.

So what the manuscripts of the middle ages show is people shooting down the nest from a tree with arrows, presumably from a bow. Right?
That would be too easy!


.jpg   ex.JPG (Size: 65.16 KB / Downloads: 138)

The slingshot does seem to be quite a popular adaptation, however there are many variations that achieve the same message overall. 


.jpg   bir.JPG (Size: 77.25 KB / Downloads: 137)

The mountain crag/cliff part of the story seems to not be as popular. At least I haven't found examples. 
Personally I had taken the VMS images to show mountain/cliff - However Rene notes "The two at the bottom are a bit larger and appear to have some elements of flowers." You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.

If you look at the examples above and the ones here You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view., you will note many of the trees are more "plant-like" than "tree-like".. but either way, I think its safe to say the VMS drawing is ambiguous and mountain/big plant.. things, might be in the ballpark. 

Reading the image counter clock-wise, 

Person (seems like a man) with a round thing in hand, on cliff/plant.. thing
I flipped this image just to show the hand better
 

.jpg   cliff1.JPG (Size: 73.36 KB / Downloads: 143)

Person (seems like a man) with movement lines shooting up from hand (throwing/shooting/projectile..ing?)


.jpg   cliff2.JPG (Size: 55.53 KB / Downloads: 143)

Bird seemingly on a nest (Speculatively, I have wondered if the circles with lines coming down to nest are balls hitting it)


.jpg   cliff3.JPG (Size: 44.41 KB / Downloads: 142)

Bird is flying/falling, a bunch of stuff falls down, so far that it goes through the text. 


.jpg   cliff4.JPG (Size: 67.72 KB / Downloads: 142)

Might I have a story of the Cinnamologus?

On researching the fancy containers starting on You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. my feeling currently is that they are containers for spice, and other valuable ingredients. They also appear in the middle of the ROS (the other side of f86v3). If my hunch is right, a story about the origins of Cinnamon planted in the middle doesn't seem out of place.

Sorry for a wall of text, hopefully it wasn't too boring. I'd like to hear what you think.]]> <![CDATA[A match for the containers? 16th-17th century ivory vases]]> https://www.voynich.ninja/thread-6174.html Wed, 07 Oct 2026 20:16:43 +0000 JustAnotherTheory]]> https://www.voynich.ninja/thread-6174.html

.png   01.png (Size: 637.92 KB / Downloads: 309)

It appears to me that these ivory objects ressemble the containers in the VMS. Many of these, and indeed others in 16th-17th century ivory vase collections from Italy and South Germany, appear to bear close parallels to the VMS. Note that ivory working was not established before the 16th century.


.png   02.png (Size: 534.03 KB / Downloads: 309)


.png   19.png (Size: 320.12 KB / Downloads: 307)


.png   assortment.png (Size: 452.58 KB / Downloads: 309)

Now take a look at Rudolf II's collection.


.png   rud.png (Size: 222.82 KB / Downloads: 310)


.png   rud2.png (Size: 260.83 KB / Downloads: 308)

Again, please note that ivory working began after 1500.]]>

.png   01.png (Size: 637.92 KB / Downloads: 309)

It appears to me that these ivory objects ressemble the containers in the VMS. Many of these, and indeed others in 16th-17th century ivory vase collections from Italy and South Germany, appear to bear close parallels to the VMS. Note that ivory working was not established before the 16th century.


.png   02.png (Size: 534.03 KB / Downloads: 309)


.png   19.png (Size: 320.12 KB / Downloads: 307)


.png   assortment.png (Size: 452.58 KB / Downloads: 309)

Now take a look at Rudolf II's collection.


.png   rud.png (Size: 222.82 KB / Downloads: 310)


.png   rud2.png (Size: 260.83 KB / Downloads: 308)

Again, please note that ivory working began after 1500.]]> <![CDATA[[split] Taccola spillover thread]]> https://www.voynich.ninja/thread-6176.html Tue, 06 Oct 2026 04:25:57 +0000 JustAnotherTheory]]> https://www.voynich.ninja/thread-6176.html
I see no point in having to copy two images from a personal sketchbook. If some some reason that sketchbook is important; then why did the artist not copy more pictures, like tens, or more? Why just 2?

It makes no sense. Unless you're a relative of Taccola and have eyes on his manuscript every day.

Otherwise, why not just go to the library and take one of the many engineering books, or Konrad Kyeser instead?

_______________________________________

Edit KG: I am hijacking the first post to add this overview of Taccola-related MSS by Ed:

(08-10-2026, 06:43 PM)DG97EEB wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.TACCOLA — AUTOGRAPHS
- Munich, BSB Clm 197,II — De ingeneis I–II + "Notebook" (c.1419–c.1450; KdiH gives 1441) — You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
- Florence, BNCF Palatino 766 — De ingeneis III–IV, dedicated to Sigismund (c.1431–1433) — You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
- Munich, BSB Clm 28800 — De machinis (completed 1449) — You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
COPIES OF DE MACHINIS
- Paris, BnF lat. 7239 — Paolo Santini copy (1459?, Venice; before 1475) — You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
- New York Public Library, Spencer Coll. MS 136 ("Codex Wilczek II") — 15th-c. copy, exact date not established — You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
- Venice, Marciana Lat. VIII, 40 (=2941) — later excerpts, date not established — You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
DERIVATIVE COMPILATIONS
- London, BL Add MS 34113 — excerpts from De ingeneis, De machinis and Francesco di Giorgio's Codicetto (2nd half 15th c.; additions dated 1612) — You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
- Dresden, SLUB — military-technical miscellany with drawings after Taccola, Valturio, Francesco di Giorgio (c.1440–1460, per Handschriftenportal) — You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
RELATED
- Vatican, BAV Urb. lat. 1757 — Francesco di Giorgio, Codicetto, free copies after Taccola (c.1465–1470/76) — You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
- Florence, BNCF Palatino 767 — later excerpts (date not established) — no link
]]>
I see no point in having to copy two images from a personal sketchbook. If some some reason that sketchbook is important; then why did the artist not copy more pictures, like tens, or more? Why just 2?

It makes no sense. Unless you're a relative of Taccola and have eyes on his manuscript every day.

Otherwise, why not just go to the library and take one of the many engineering books, or Konrad Kyeser instead?

_______________________________________

Edit KG: I am hijacking the first post to add this overview of Taccola-related MSS by Ed:

(08-10-2026, 06:43 PM)DG97EEB wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.TACCOLA — AUTOGRAPHS
- Munich, BSB Clm 197,II — De ingeneis I–II + "Notebook" (c.1419–c.1450; KdiH gives 1441) — You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
- Florence, BNCF Palatino 766 — De ingeneis III–IV, dedicated to Sigismund (c.1431–1433) — You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
- Munich, BSB Clm 28800 — De machinis (completed 1449) — You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
COPIES OF DE MACHINIS
- Paris, BnF lat. 7239 — Paolo Santini copy (1459?, Venice; before 1475) — You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
- New York Public Library, Spencer Coll. MS 136 ("Codex Wilczek II") — 15th-c. copy, exact date not established — You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
- Venice, Marciana Lat. VIII, 40 (=2941) — later excerpts, date not established — You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
DERIVATIVE COMPILATIONS
- London, BL Add MS 34113 — excerpts from De ingeneis, De machinis and Francesco di Giorgio's Codicetto (2nd half 15th c.; additions dated 1612) — You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
- Dresden, SLUB — military-technical miscellany with drawings after Taccola, Valturio, Francesco di Giorgio (c.1440–1460, per Handschriftenportal) — You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
RELATED
- Vatican, BAV Urb. lat. 1757 — Francesco di Giorgio, Codicetto, free copies after Taccola (c.1465–1470/76) — You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
- Florence, BNCF Palatino 767 — later excerpts (date not established) — no link
]]> <![CDATA[F80r - Leprosy in La Franceschina 1474]]> https://www.voynich.ninja/thread-6162.html Sun, 04 Oct 2026 21:30:19 +0000 Bluetoes101]]> https://www.voynich.ninja/thread-6162.html Register or Login to view. maybe resembling "clappers", and there was a bit of discussion about it. 

What caught my eye is the monk(?)/healer using tongues/forceps on the person in the bed above the person with the clappers in the lower down bed. There is also another person with them sitting to the left. 

I don't have much to add, I just thought it was an interesting comparison that may incorporate both objects in this section of You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. and leprosy/clappers previously discussed. 


.jpg   slp.JPG (Size: 286.97 KB / Downloads: 181)


Links to image
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.

Books is here - Image on 223r
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.]]> Register or Login to view. maybe resembling "clappers", and there was a bit of discussion about it. 

What caught my eye is the monk(?)/healer using tongues/forceps on the person in the bed above the person with the clappers in the lower down bed. There is also another person with them sitting to the left. 

I don't have much to add, I just thought it was an interesting comparison that may incorporate both objects in this section of You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. and leprosy/clappers previously discussed. 


.jpg   slp.JPG (Size: 286.97 KB / Downloads: 181)


Links to image
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.

Books is here - Image on 223r
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.]]> <![CDATA[Faces in roots]]> https://www.voynich.ninja/thread-6149.html Fri, 02 Oct 2026 20:45:20 +0000 Bart V]]> https://www.voynich.ninja/thread-6149.html I think, because it does not occur in other drawings (as I can see), this could be considered marginalia.
What do you think?
.png   Schermafbeelding 2026-10-02 221632.png (Size: 1.05 MB / Downloads: 67) ]]> I think, because it does not occur in other drawings (as I can see), this could be considered marginalia.
What do you think?
.png   Schermafbeelding 2026-10-02 221632.png (Size: 1.05 MB / Downloads: 67) ]]> <![CDATA[Voynichy Faces: BNF Coislin 174]]> https://www.voynich.ninja/thread-6145.html Fri, 02 Oct 2026 10:08:08 +0000 eggyk]]> https://www.voynich.ninja/thread-6145.html
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. 
1376-1425AD
Unknown location? (Supposedly later owned by "Daniel Caetani of Cremona" ~1527AD, so was in Italy at that point).

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.jpg   faces1.JPG (Size: 20.6 KB / Downloads: 172)

I'm actually getting a little doubtful as I write this post... have these faces already been shared and are common knowledge? I really feel like i've seen them before but I simply cannot find them mentioned anywhere.]]>
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1376-1425AD
Unknown location? (Supposedly later owned by "Daniel Caetani of Cremona" ~1527AD, so was in Italy at that point).

Extra Links: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. / You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.


.jpg   faces1.JPG (Size: 20.6 KB / Downloads: 172)

I'm actually getting a little doubtful as I write this post... have these faces already been shared and are common knowledge? I really feel like i've seen them before but I simply cannot find them mentioned anywhere.]]> <![CDATA[Rosettes as a ... magic altar]]> https://www.voynich.ninja/thread-6140.html Thu, 01 Oct 2026 11:25:25 +0000 Rafal]]> https://www.voynich.ninja/thread-6140.html
How do you find the idea that the Rosettes "map" is actually a kind of portable altar used for contacting the spirits?

As you may know from my previous posts I like the idea that Voynich Manuscript was once a bunch of loose pages used by some wandering charlatan. So "contacting the spirits" wouldn't be real, it would be a show for some silly folks willing to throw a few pfennigs into charlatan's bowl for it. He would "reveal the future" for them or get some blessing from the spirits.

There is something as almadel ( You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. ) which is exactly such an altar. It isn't the same as Rosettes but it gives some vibes:

.png   almadel.png (Size: 358.21 KB / Downloads: 175)

In such altar there was a central place, sometimes called locus (place, point) where you put a crystal ball to contact the spirits. That would be "Heavenly Jerusalem" part of the Rosettes.

[Image: ded0427d28ffca0d2ba964de634ecc7e.jpg]
[Image: Voynich_rosettes11.jpg]

In these altars  the central point is surrounded by other points that may symbolize planets, angels, or some "points of power" responsible for different areas like health, love, prosperity, luck etc.

There were many similar diagrams which could work as well as altars in magical grimoires. I include some examples below which all are a bit Rosettes like for me. The modern stuff in the pictures was made according to much older sources like Lesser Key of Solomon.

.jpg   p1.jpg (Size: 88.96 KB / Downloads: 171)

These pictures are not the same as Rosettes but it isn't a big problem for me. There weren't big magical traditions and standards in Medieval Ages. Magical treatises could exist only in one copy or at most few copies. When authorities got their hands on them, they happily burnt them. Not many of them survived. So when you compare grimoires they differ a lot, give very different lists of angels and demons, desribe different ceremonies and have different imagery.

And don't forget that the Voynich artist could know they won't be really summoning spirits but rather cheating people so he could be a bit freestyling and doing it his own way.

I may write a bit more later. But as for now, how do you like the magic altar idea?]]>
How do you find the idea that the Rosettes "map" is actually a kind of portable altar used for contacting the spirits?

As you may know from my previous posts I like the idea that Voynich Manuscript was once a bunch of loose pages used by some wandering charlatan. So "contacting the spirits" wouldn't be real, it would be a show for some silly folks willing to throw a few pfennigs into charlatan's bowl for it. He would "reveal the future" for them or get some blessing from the spirits.

There is something as almadel ( You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. ) which is exactly such an altar. It isn't the same as Rosettes but it gives some vibes:

.png   almadel.png (Size: 358.21 KB / Downloads: 175)

In such altar there was a central place, sometimes called locus (place, point) where you put a crystal ball to contact the spirits. That would be "Heavenly Jerusalem" part of the Rosettes.

[Image: ded0427d28ffca0d2ba964de634ecc7e.jpg]
[Image: Voynich_rosettes11.jpg]

In these altars  the central point is surrounded by other points that may symbolize planets, angels, or some "points of power" responsible for different areas like health, love, prosperity, luck etc.

There were many similar diagrams which could work as well as altars in magical grimoires. I include some examples below which all are a bit Rosettes like for me. The modern stuff in the pictures was made according to much older sources like Lesser Key of Solomon.

.jpg   p1.jpg (Size: 88.96 KB / Downloads: 171)

These pictures are not the same as Rosettes but it isn't a big problem for me. There weren't big magical traditions and standards in Medieval Ages. Magical treatises could exist only in one copy or at most few copies. When authorities got their hands on them, they happily burnt them. Not many of them survived. So when you compare grimoires they differ a lot, give very different lists of angels and demons, desribe different ceremonies and have different imagery.

And don't forget that the Voynich artist could know they won't be really summoning spirits but rather cheating people so he could be a bit freestyling and doing it his own way.

I may write a bit more later. But as for now, how do you like the magic altar idea?]]> <![CDATA[Color of the water on f79v as an indicator of religious cleanliness]]> https://www.voynich.ninja/thread-6128.html Mon, 28 Sep 2026 22:15:06 +0000 Not_A_Corncob]]> https://www.voynich.ninja/thread-6128.html
Apologies if this page has already been done to death.  I just keep looking at the tubes pages and thinking about what they might mean.

I kept thinking about how odd the water is.  In some pages, it's blue!  In others, it's green.

I was thinking about how stoic some of the green water people looked, and started looking at other manuscripts.

Laufenberg's regimen of health has a depiction of what I think is Jesus' descent into hell, but please correct me if I'm wrong.  My medieval German is, uh, not conversational.

Here is the image in question: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.

Now, I have yet to find a 15th century manuscript that depicts hell as green, but it got me thinking about similar concepts.

On f79v, on the top left, there is a woman with a cross under an umbrella shape.  I cannot tell if the shape is meant to represent a basin of pure water, or the firmament.

[Image: image.jpg?ref=f79v&q=f79v-255-64-423-357...&caption=1]

Notice how she is standing upright, holding a cross.

Below her is a woman lounging on her back, wearing some kind of head covering and some kind of wring, bracelet or shackle.

[Image: image.jpg?ref=f79v&q=f79v-249-297-475-48...&caption=1]

She is being sprayed in the face by the water up above, which is a little funny.

Below her, the water comes out green.

[Image: image.jpg?ref=f79v&q=f79v-249-720-297-50...&caption=1]

It's interesting to me that the water coming into this basin is green, but the water in the other pipes is still blue.  The figure on this tier doesn't seem to be immersed in water at all!

From below this section, it looks like blue water comes out of one spout, but then the other tubes feeding into the funnel have green in them.  Below that, you have the green water splashing down into the green pool that has the fish eating the woman (or mermaid, per other threads) and the various beasties.

[Image: image.jpg?ref=f79v&q=f79v-254-953-409-89...&caption=1]


Water used as an allegorical substance wouldn't be out of the question in the medieval world. The bible has lots of references to ritual cleanliness, living waters, and the like. The exordium magnum cistercience refers to the cistercian order as a pure fountain.  I do not have a facsimile of this document, but this paper on medieval water symbolism has a translated quote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.



"""
Here begins the narrative of the beginning of the Cistercian Order, how our fathers left the monastery of Molesme in order to recover the purity of the Order according to the Rule of St Benedict and founded the fertile house of Cîteaux which is the mother of all our houses, since from her, as if from the purest fountain, the rivers of all the churches of our Order flow (Burton and Kerr, 2011: 21, italics in original).
"""

folio You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. has more water imagery, this time seemingly only of clean water.  Right near the top, we see a woman in a hair covering on top of either a cistern or possibly a smaller version of the figure on the previous page, which I took to be either a cistern or a representation of the firmament.

[Image: image.jpg?ref=f80r&q=f80r-597-34-389-323...&caption=1]

At this point, I'm starting to go cross-eyed from zooming in on all these tubes and ponds to inspect the water color and the faces of the people within the water, so not sure if I'm getting tunnel vision on this one.

What do you all think?]]>
Apologies if this page has already been done to death.  I just keep looking at the tubes pages and thinking about what they might mean.

I kept thinking about how odd the water is.  In some pages, it's blue!  In others, it's green.

I was thinking about how stoic some of the green water people looked, and started looking at other manuscripts.

Laufenberg's regimen of health has a depiction of what I think is Jesus' descent into hell, but please correct me if I'm wrong.  My medieval German is, uh, not conversational.

Here is the image in question: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.

Now, I have yet to find a 15th century manuscript that depicts hell as green, but it got me thinking about similar concepts.

On f79v, on the top left, there is a woman with a cross under an umbrella shape.  I cannot tell if the shape is meant to represent a basin of pure water, or the firmament.

[Image: image.jpg?ref=f79v&q=f79v-255-64-423-357...&caption=1]

Notice how she is standing upright, holding a cross.

Below her is a woman lounging on her back, wearing some kind of head covering and some kind of wring, bracelet or shackle.

[Image: image.jpg?ref=f79v&q=f79v-249-297-475-48...&caption=1]

She is being sprayed in the face by the water up above, which is a little funny.

Below her, the water comes out green.

[Image: image.jpg?ref=f79v&q=f79v-249-720-297-50...&caption=1]

It's interesting to me that the water coming into this basin is green, but the water in the other pipes is still blue.  The figure on this tier doesn't seem to be immersed in water at all!

From below this section, it looks like blue water comes out of one spout, but then the other tubes feeding into the funnel have green in them.  Below that, you have the green water splashing down into the green pool that has the fish eating the woman (or mermaid, per other threads) and the various beasties.

[Image: image.jpg?ref=f79v&q=f79v-254-953-409-89...&caption=1]


Water used as an allegorical substance wouldn't be out of the question in the medieval world. The bible has lots of references to ritual cleanliness, living waters, and the like. The exordium magnum cistercience refers to the cistercian order as a pure fountain.  I do not have a facsimile of this document, but this paper on medieval water symbolism has a translated quote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.



"""
Here begins the narrative of the beginning of the Cistercian Order, how our fathers left the monastery of Molesme in order to recover the purity of the Order according to the Rule of St Benedict and founded the fertile house of Cîteaux which is the mother of all our houses, since from her, as if from the purest fountain, the rivers of all the churches of our Order flow (Burton and Kerr, 2011: 21, italics in original).
"""

folio You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. has more water imagery, this time seemingly only of clean water.  Right near the top, we see a woman in a hair covering on top of either a cistern or possibly a smaller version of the figure on the previous page, which I took to be either a cistern or a representation of the firmament.

[Image: image.jpg?ref=f80r&q=f80r-597-34-389-323...&caption=1]

At this point, I'm starting to go cross-eyed from zooming in on all these tubes and ponds to inspect the water color and the faces of the people within the water, so not sure if I'm getting tunnel vision on this one.

What do you all think?]]> <![CDATA[It's a falcon on 80v - with Chaucer's magical ring]]> https://www.voynich.ninja/thread-6127.html Mon, 28 Sep 2026 21:52:06 +0000 SherriMM]]> https://www.voynich.ninja/thread-6127.html Register or Login to view.

In this post, I identify the animal on folio 80v as a falcon (not an armadillo or dragon, etc). I also draw connection with Chaucer's story of The Squire's Tale - in which a princess receives a magical ring that gives her the ability to understand all animals and to know the curing power of herbs, which she uses to heal an injured falcon. Please follow the link for the full explanation. 

I am not necessarily saying that this story of Chaucer's appears in the Voynich, but that perhaps they both drew of an earlier tradition....but also that this animal is totally a falcon. 

Your thoughts?

All the best, 
Sherri

.png   Your paragraph text (26).png (Size: 1.19 MB / Downloads: 167) ]]> Register or Login to view.

In this post, I identify the animal on folio 80v as a falcon (not an armadillo or dragon, etc). I also draw connection with Chaucer's story of The Squire's Tale - in which a princess receives a magical ring that gives her the ability to understand all animals and to know the curing power of herbs, which she uses to heal an injured falcon. Please follow the link for the full explanation. 

I am not necessarily saying that this story of Chaucer's appears in the Voynich, but that perhaps they both drew of an earlier tradition....but also that this animal is totally a falcon. 

Your thoughts?

All the best, 
Sherri

.png   Your paragraph text (26).png (Size: 1.19 MB / Downloads: 167) ]]> <![CDATA[The Seasons of Life on f85r2]]> https://www.voynich.ninja/thread-6122.html Sat, 26 Sep 2026 17:06:35 +0000 pjburkshire]]> https://www.voynich.ninja/thread-6122.html
I think the Seasons of Life theme needs to be continued.  The Zodiac is clearly about birth; the beginning of a person's life on Earth.  A person's zodiac sign is based on when they were born.  You know I believe the focus should be on the birth part and not on constellations.

I think you need to go even another step.  There is no birth without a pregnancy.

The Voynich Manuscript is a Christian document.  It is about both physical life on Earth and about spiritual life beyond Earth.

I still believe that the goal in the creation of the Voynich Manuscript was to take medical and spiritual information from Latin (probably multiple sources) and make it available to young men who did not know Latin.]]>
I think the Seasons of Life theme needs to be continued.  The Zodiac is clearly about birth; the beginning of a person's life on Earth.  A person's zodiac sign is based on when they were born.  You know I believe the focus should be on the birth part and not on constellations.

I think you need to go even another step.  There is no birth without a pregnancy.

The Voynich Manuscript is a Christian document.  It is about both physical life on Earth and about spiritual life beyond Earth.

I still believe that the goal in the creation of the Voynich Manuscript was to take medical and spiritual information from Latin (probably multiple sources) and make it available to young men who did not know Latin.]]>