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+--- Thread: Why the rosettes image may not be a map at all (/thread-653.html)
RE: Why the rosettes image may not be a map at all - Searcher - 24-07-2016
The central detail of some tent-looking objects You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. quite can be a handle for / that means rotation, for examle, as in the Wheel of Fortune.
![[Image: fortune_wheel_01.jpg]](https://hitchhikershedge.files.wordpress.com/2010/09/fortune_wheel_01.jpg)
![[Image: wheel_of_fortune.jpg]](http://www.alchemywebsite.com/tarot/samples/wheel_of_fortune.jpg)
RE: Why the rosettes image may not be a map at all - Anton - 24-07-2016
Interpretation of those tusks as crescents leads to stunning results.You know, when you see moons, you count them, to begin with. I counted them, and the number of these crescents is thirty seven.
Von Humboldt You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. (p. 127) that the ecclesiastical (if the term may be used) year of Muysca indians contained 37 moons. He further suggests (p. 235) that the cycle of twenty times thirty seven sunas is an Asiatic one, not specifying which Asicatic calendar this is exactly.
Assuming the VMS is pre-Columbian, what calendars have been there with 37 moons?
RE: Why the rosettes image may not be a map at all - Oocephalus - 24-07-2016
MarcoP:
Quote:About this detail, I think Ellie Velinska is right: the two structures are rectangular tents or baldaquins, with hanging fringes and supporting poles. I can't see how they could be the four rivers of paradise.I can see this, but couldn't this just mean that Paradise is placed above the rest of the "world" of that rosette, just as the starry sky is in the central rosette?
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Anton:
Quote:Von Humboldt You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. (p. 127) that the ecclesiastical (if the term may be used) year of Muysca indians contained 37 moons. He further suggests (p. 235) that the cycle of twenty times thirty seven sunas is an Asiatic one, not specifying which Asicatic calendar this is exactly.If I've understood correctly, he just says that this cycle of 20*37 sunas (thirty-day months) corresponds to 60 solar years. A 60-year cycle is present in the Chinese calendar, as a combination of a 10-year and a 12-year cycle.
RE: Why the rosettes image may not be a map at all - Wladimir D - 25-07-2016
Consider the lower right rosette.
It is necessary to ask ourselves question. Why on the top "tent" are depicted the pillars, similar to hollow cleaved along tube? So do or make in the manufacture of bamboo spouts.
I believe that on this rosette are two methods of water collection shown.
1. It is conceivable that the lower tent has a concave profile and all the water is collected in a center, where tube is located (middle a pillar in the figure), through which water flows downward and is fed to consumers.
2. The second method is illustrated in another circuit.
RE: Why the rosettes image may not be a map at all - MarcoP - 25-07-2016
Manuscript You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. (England, 2nd half of the 15th century) and its later copy You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. contain diagrams that seem to me to somehow resemble Rene's analysis of the Rosettes diagram. The center of this diagrams is a synthetic scheme of the sky (I cannot identify one of the three components, but the other two clearly are the Sun and the Moon). Edit: the third element apparently is M[ercury], thanks to Helmut!
The seven planets and the four elements are represented around the central circle.
Edit: an outer circle represents the signs of the zodiac, thanks to Helmut!
RE: Why the rosettes image may not be a map at all - Davidsch - 25-07-2016
...you all lost me here, i thought this was about the rosette page?
Now i read many pages about tents and poles and see images of nothing but tents... i am missing something somewhere
RE: Why the rosettes image may not be a map at all - Oocephalus - 25-07-2016
To be clear, I don't think there is a connection of the VMS to the Chinese calendar. Humboldt's observation is just based on the fact that 37 lunar cycles are almost exactly three years, which might explain the number of 37 moons (if they are indeed moons) in the rosette.
RE: Why the rosettes image may not be a map at all - Anton - 25-07-2016
Quote:...you all lost me here, i thought this was about the rosette page?
Now i read many pages about tents and poles and see images of nothing but tents... i am missing something somewhere
That's because the Rosettes seems to be filled with planar (and even isometric) depictions of tents (with poles).
Quote:To be clear, I don't think there is a connection of the VMS to the Chinese calendar. Humboldt's observation is just based on the fact that 37 lunar cycles are almost exactly three years, which might explain the number of 37 moons (if they are indeed moons) in the rosette.
I wander what's the origin of number 37 in the indians' calendar, to begin with. Why 37, but not 35 or 43?
And if these shapes are moons indeed, and, further, if their number is there to represent the cycle, and, furthermore, if the 37-moons cycle is met with nowhere but among the natives of Colombia, then the VMS becomes even more weird...
I would like to note that the two yellow shapes surrounding these 37 "crescents" are very much like the pattern in the centre of f67r1 which apparently depicts moon. This is an indirect confirmation that moon is indeed the concern here.
Next, the surrounding shape or background consisting of white and blue "petals" is in a certain degree similar to the one in f86v4 (although in the latter there is variation in the size of the "petals", and also some obsure persons are hidden in between). And f86v4 also has Moon in the centre!
RE: Why the rosettes image may not be a map at all - Searcher - 25-07-2016
(25-07-2016, 04:11 PM)Anton Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.Quote:To be clear, I don't think there is a connection of the VMS to the Chinese calendar. Humboldt's observation is just based on the fact that 37 lunar cycles are almost exactly three years, which might explain the number of 37 moons (if they are indeed moons) in the rosette.
I wander what's the origin of number 37 in the indians' calendar, to begin with. Why 37, but not 35 or 43?
And if these shapes are moons indeed, and, further, if their number is there to represent the cycle, and, furthermore, if the 37-moons cycle is met with nowhere but among the natives of Colombia, then the VMS becomes even more weird...
I would like to note that the two yellow shapes surrounding these 37 "crescents" are very much like the pattern in the centre of f67r1 which apparently depicts moon. This is an indirect confirmation that moon is indeed the concern here.
Next, the surrounding shape or background consisting of white and blue "petals" is in a certain degree similar to the one in f86v4 (although in the latter there is variation in the size of the "petals", and also some obsure persons are hidden in between). And f86v4 also has Moon in the centre!
It is interesting, if mentioned rosette is the object, relating to the f40v, why the last one contains only 35 moons. Two moons - difference. It's difficult to imagine that the author forgot about it in the Rosettes picture or kept the wrong count.
The flower-center of the herb, likely, means the Sun.
RE: Why the rosettes image may not be a map at all - Helmut Winkler - 25-07-2016
(25-07-2016, 11:18 AM)MarcoP Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.Manuscript You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. (England, 2nd half of the 15th century) and its later copy You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. contain diagrams that seem to me to somehow resemble Rene's analysis of the Rosettes diagram. The center of this diagrams is a synthetic scheme of the sky (I cannot identify one of the three components, but the other two clearly are the Sun and the Moon). The seven planets and the four elements are represented around the central circle.
There are the signs of the Zodiac as well and the third component looks like one of the Zodiac symbols to me, is it Capricorn?