+- The Voynich Ninja (https://www.voynich.ninja)
+-- Forum: Voynich Research (https://www.voynich.ninja/forum-27.html)
+--- Forum: Analysis of the text (https://www.voynich.ninja/forum-41.html)
+--- Thread: Is there any character like that? (/thread-4634.html)
Is there any character like that? - ErinaBee - 20-04-2025
Is there any character in the VM that is generally thought as 1 character but some people believe it to be 2 distinct characters with very subtle differences?
RE: Is there any character like that? - oshfdk - 20-04-2025
In the past I investigated the possibility of two distinct versions of EVA-L and EVA-Y based on their top being a smooth curve or a distinct angle.
The problem with these features, they mostly exist on a continuum. E.g., here I highlighted the two extremes of L, but if these are two distinct characters (they do look quite different), it's very hard to sort the rest of them into two respective groups. For example, the bottom right L, is it the smooth type or the pointy type?
RE: Is there any character like that? - nablator - 20-04-2025
(20-04-2025, 08:11 AM)ErinaBee Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.Is there any character in the VM that is generally thought as 1 character but some people believe it to be 2 distinct characters with very subtle differences?
All of them, and often more than 2.
RE: Is there any character like that? - Stefan Wirtz_2 - 20-04-2025
(20-04-2025, 08:11 AM)ErinaBee Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.Is there any character in the VM that is generally thought as 1 character but some people believe it to be 2 distinct characters with very subtle differences?
As far as I could judge this and showed it here You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. in the first comment,
there is at least ch to be seen as the "op"-combination. To be exact, it would be 2 characters composing 2 letters, but the ch is considered as 1 character by many people.
RE: Is there any character like that? - nablator - 20-04-2025
(20-04-2025, 08:42 AM)oshfdk Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.In the past I investigated the possibility of two distinct versions of EVA-L and EVA-Y based on their top being a smooth curve or a distinct angle.
The problem with these features, they mostly exist on a continuum. E.g., here I highlighted the two extremes of L, but if these are two distinct characters (they do look quite different), it's very hard to sort the rest of them into two respective groups.
The right part of l, like o, can be more or less angular or round.
For l, there is a variant that was identified as a separate character in the Ardic (Turkish) solution: the one with the short left leg.
Variants of l that are never identified AFAIK are the low and high variants. The low variant has the top if its loop aligned with o, as in the two first ol in the last line of your image, the loop of the high variant goes significantly higher and the end of the 2nd stroke aligns with the baseline. But yes, it's a continuum, sometimes it's impossible to decide which of the two variants it is.
RE: Is there any character like that? - Aga Tentakulus - 20-04-2025
I have written a paper about this possibility.
I even think it is likely, considering the slow progress in decoding. It would almost double the entropy.
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
RE: Is there any character like that? - Aga Tentakulus - 20-04-2025
In 2014, I also explained step by step how the VM should be viewed.
Structure of the system explained step by step.
You no longer need to search for the page on the net. Page has been deleted. I wrote about it.
RE: Is there any character like that? - BessAgritianin - 21-04-2025
(20-04-2025, 08:11 AM)ErinaBee Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.Is there any character in the VM that is generally thought as 1 character but some people believe it to be 2 distinct characters with very subtle differences?I would rephrase your question:
"Is there one character that is definitively singular in identity, without representing anything beyond itself?"
From a layperson perspective (like we all obviously are), characters appear to have fixed meaning. But is it so?
My humble experience teaches me- not.
RE: Is there any character like that? - RadioFM - 21-04-2025
I'm curious to know how many people here (at least those more on the cypher, not-hoax camp) think of qo as a single unit instead of q + o, despite q acting as a prefix to many valid o- words or even to y and e in a few cases.
RE: Is there any character like that? - BessAgritianin - 21-04-2025
(21-04-2025, 06:17 AM)RadioFM Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.I'm curious to know how many people here (at least those more on the cypher, not-hoax camp) think of qo as a single unit instead of q + o, despite q acting as a prefix to many valid o- words or even to y and e in a few cases.I think it is a single character and it is the only which has only one meaning.