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+-- Forum: Voynich Research (https://www.voynich.ninja/forum-27.html)
+--- Forum: Marginalia (https://www.voynich.ninja/forum-45.html)
+--- Thread: 116v (/thread-437.html)
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RE: 116v - Monica Yokubinas - 30-11-2019
I do not know what the smaller letters on the bottom left are, but the V looking alchemical symbol is for reduction. The Voynich words above the prone lady on 66r are: firepot proper rest my/proper hidding place to heal secret parts eliminate/root out/mopping up.
RE: 116v - Aga Tentakulus - 30-11-2019
@Anton
" gas mich "
The word milk is written with L from England to Italy. I just can't imagine anyone mistyping such a simple word.
I also don't know any dialect form where milk looks like that.
I think the goat upstairs leads me to that conclusion.
The picture above the goat shows the intestines, lungs and abomasum.
RE: 116v - Aga Tentakulus - 30-11-2019
RE: 116v - Anton - 30-11-2019
Yes I'm in favor of "gas mich" as well, although somewhere above in the thread there was an extensive discussion about that, and the point of those arguing in favour of "gasmi(l)ch" was, if i remember correctly, that "milch" is (or was) often reducted to "mich" in oral speech, and in Middle Ages there was no standard spelling, and folks often wrote just what they heard, so one could write milk down as "mich".
The ruminant to the left being interpreted as goat, this biases the interpretation of "gas" towards "geis"; although I'm not at all certain that, in the first place, it's a goat (may well be a lamb), and, in the second place, that the imagery to the left relates to the text on the right, to begin with.
In my opinion, the abomasum is the best guess, especially insofar it's annotated as "lab", but some interpret that as liver, connecting that to "pox leber" in the first line.
RE: 116v - MarcoP - 30-11-2019
Hi Aga, could you please let us know what is the source of the image at the bottom-left? (it appears to be an Eastern manuscript)
RE: 116v - -JKP- - 30-11-2019
I have it somewhere in my files, but can't remember the shelfmark. It's Egyptian, I believe (anatomy of a horse), 15th century. University of Istanbul. And I'm almost certain someone else has posted it on the forum, as well, a year or two ago.
RE: 116v - -JKP- - 30-11-2019
Okay, found it. My files are now stretched over several huge hard drives... it's becoming hard to find things...
U of Istanbul Inv AY4689 folio 41r.
RE: 116v - Aga Tentakulus - 30-11-2019
This is still the original where I still have
RE: 116v - Aga Tentakulus - 01-12-2019
(07-09-2016, 08:25 PM)MarcoP Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.Another incantation from You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view..
It is mostly German, so I can't read it. But the Latin is:
...German... rax pax fax ++++ in xpo [christo] + filio + da=
vid ...German . . . appolo[n]ia .....
..... ave ma[r]ia
The "rax pax fax" could parallel "six+marix+movix+vix" in line 3.
That seems to have raised some questions. I think I'll translate it.
"Ischs'en den zant schmeren" If it hurts the tooth, "schreiss an daz wäg mit ainem riutten" scream it, the away with a ryten ( Rytual ).
"rex pax fax etc." I have no idea for this meaning.
I don't know "uid", but I think "nid" needs "need".
"unschreiss den namen appalaja" and scream ( or not scream ) (un = not), the name Appalaja.
"Nu sprich 3 pa vu and 3 ave maria." Now speek 3 ( pater unser , father unser ). Now speek 3
RE: 116v - -JKP- - 02-12-2019
Between 2013 and Jan. 2016, I posted several blogs with examples of medieval charms and I still feel the same now as I did then, that the layout of the words, the order of the words, the content of the words (Latin words that don't quite seem to mean anything mixed with other words, sometimes in another language) on 116v is very similar to medieval remedies/charms.
Here are links to some pictorial examples of shield charms, talismanic charms, and recipe-like charms (similar to the VMS):
- Format of charms and use of plus signs You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
- Simple talismanic shield charms: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
Use of the charm word "abracula", which is a magical word similar to "abracadabra" "adonay" and numerous others. It's possible "oladabas" is a magical word rather than a regular one.
- Examples of recipe-like charms—many of them have a format similar to the VMS: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
Also, we had quite a long thread about charms in 2016 and it included references to Clm 671.