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+--- Thread: f18v (/thread-2917.html)
f18v - Koen G - 04-09-2019
I just took a decent look at the root of You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. for the first time, and I can't make heads nor tails of it. Well, I can make a tail, which is (I hope) rather clearly suggested in the bottom-right appendage. Tuft at the end and all, like the standard "feline" root tail. There are also tufts of fur indicated along the "body' and the top knot.
What I noticed for the first time today is the pattern that's in the negative on the bottom, as if it's half submerged in waves? I highlighted the area below:
Apart from that, I don't know what to make of the other wiggly looking appendages and the strange angular shapes, nor the thing on top of the root that looks like a hairy square with rounded corners. The leftmost part of the rood is vaguely claw-like, but not terribly convincingly so.
The leaves look relatively realistic. In another thread, JKP suggested Malva, so the image may be based on this plant or a similar one.
The flower though, does not look realistic at all, its size, shape, proportions and components are all off to some degree. The lower pattern is that used for mountains, and above it what I think is "an event in the sky". The "sky" part even appears somewhat elevated above the "land" part. I have no idea about the red structure or a possible meaning of it all.
RE: f18v - davidjackson - 05-09-2019
I think it just looks like a stylised Malva root. You've got the main trunk of the root with all the little branches, and it tapers away. Like this Cheese weed example :
![[Image: Malva-parviflora.jpeg]](https://permies.com/t/23121/a/8384/Malva-parviflora.jpeg)
RE: f18v - -JKP- - 05-09-2019
If you wait until fall when the petals roll back (or fall off), or simply peel off the petals to show the rest of the structure, it's looks quite close to the VMS plant.
What is distinctive about Hibiscus/Malva is the red-knobbed five-branched stigma, and the hairy-looking filaments on the anther.
The VMS root, however, looks like something more is going on.
RE: f18v - Koen G - 05-09-2019
David, with all the lions in the VM roots, you're telling me this one doesn't have a tail as well?
My point is that it doesn't taper. The three parts are too distinct to be a real root. Some kind of square on top, then a horizontal fat part, then suddenly a tail with the typical tuft at the end.
RE: f18v - Common_Man - 05-09-2019
I'm seeing the 5 holy wounds everywhere now
, especially when there are 5 holes and red colour around them...
RE: f18v - Koen G - 05-09-2019
(05-09-2019, 06:53 AM)Common_Man Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.I'm seeing the 5 holy wounds everywhere now
That's the thing, they are hard to miss once you're aware of them. The one top right specifically does seem to have the typical white-red-black layers going on. I didn't call it right away because of the strange structure they are on though. But it's something to keep in mind.
RE: f18v - Koen G - 05-09-2019
JKP: this analysis requires the combination of typical elements of two plants, right? Leaves of Malva, five red knobs of Hibiscus?
It's quite possible that they did this, and I think you are right that this explains the structure in the flower. Note though, that (as far as I can tell), these five knobs in hibiscus are of equal size and arranged in a circle, while in the VM one is in the middle, which is a lot thicker. They've also made sure to put a black dot in each of the knobs.
RE: f18v - -JKP- - 05-09-2019
They're all part of the Malvaceae family (closely related), the Hibiscus and Mallows. Sometimes we say "Mallow" family even though that's not as accurate as Malvaceae.
It's a bit like saying "carrot family" for a broad range of umbillifers.
The Malvaceae all have that five-pronged stigma and many features in common.
Here's a good example that shows it really clearly: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
But below the stigma/style is an enigma...
The calyx of the Malvaceae (the green part under where the petals attach) sometimes has a double row, some spiky pointy parts and within them, a broader calyx but I'm not sure if this completely accounts for the way the flower part of the VMS flower is drawn. It's almost scaly (more like the aster family) and doesn't have the hirsute style (I mean the morphological part called the "style") that is so typical of the mallow family.
So, even though I strongly suspect this plant was inspired by the mallow family, which was known throughout Europe (hollyhocks in the north, Hibiscus in the south), the stigma is unmistakable and clearly not drawn by accident, there might be a symbolic reason for the way the "cup" under it is drawn and, as you noted, the emphasis on the center stigma (it's almost candelabra-like).
In the Bible, "mallow" probably doesn't mean what it does now. There are some who think it might be a goosefoot plant. It's something bushy with seedy stalks like grain that may have been harvested as famine-food.
RE: f18v - Koen G - 06-09-2019
JKP, the main reason why I think it's something in the sky is the same use of patterns as in the Rosettes foldout. Perhaps this part especially:
I'm not saying they must be the same thing or whatever, but they use the same visual vocabulary. Note the shape of the opening, the "mountains", the rays, the stars... And then together with the strange stigma, it's just a bit much...
Not to mention the whole root thing, of course.
RE: f18v - -JKP- - 06-09-2019
I agree with you about the visual vocabulary. Whoever designed the VMS was very orderly, there's evidence of that all over the place, so I would not be surprised if certain shapes referred to certain things (or certain categories of things).