The Voynich Ninja
Choice of glyphs - Printable Version

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Choice of glyphs - Koen G - 07-04-2019

We know almost for sure that the Voynichese glyph set was purposefully assembled. By which I mean, it did not organically evolve over centuries. The fact that we have this particular collection of glyphs is likely the result of someone's (or a group's) conscious choice.

We don't know if the glyph set was first constructed for the VM, and if more documents using it have existed. We also don't know if there are earlier or other versions elsewhere. But this matters little, we have what we have.

So I've been thinking for a while... if we can assume that these glyphs were chosen, then what was the rationale behind their inclusion? It's quite a peculiar set.

  • a - letter a --> vowel
  • o - letter o or zero --> vowel or number
  • l - four --> number
  • q - four or five or q? --> number or consonant
  • d - d or s or eight --> number or consonant
  • y - abbreviation or nine --> abbreviation or number
  • s - abbreviation
  • m - abbreviation
  • g - abbreviation
  • n - abbreviation
  • ch - ligature
  • sh - ligature
  • r - consonant (or abbreviation?)
  • e - c? or minim? what is this?
  • i - letter i? or minim?
  • t - abbreviation (?)
  • k - abbreviation (?)
  • z - abbreviation (?)

This list is made off the top of my head from what I remember, it's incomplete and I hope it can be fleshed out further and corrected. Still, it's a strange picture already. 

We have:
  • 5 glyphs that can be numbers
  • About 10 glyphs in the ligature/abbreviation category
  • Very few glyphs that are exclusively vowel or consonant. EVA-a is an exception. I'm not sure what to do with EVA-i and -e. EVA-r might be a pure consonant?
What does this tell us? It appears that the glyph set is mostly composed of numbers and scribal conventions. Those few that are found in the alphabet often double as a number or abbreviation. So the glyph set simultaneously:

- Avoids unambiguous characters from the alphabet. 
- Uses characters familiar to the Latin scribe.

The final point might also be of interest. The selection of known symbols likely meant that the writing system could be learned easily.
But why construct a glyph set that relies so heavily on numbers and abbreviation symbols?


RE: Choice of glyphs - Linda - 07-04-2019

I think this exercise could prove fruitful, as i do think there is purpose in the choosing.

It almost seems to me that it is somehow intended to refer back to their usage in earlier texts. 
It may help to include different forms, such as r rotunda sometimes looks like a 2, or a z as well as half r

The history of humanist miniscule might be important as well

[Image: 1024px-Evolution_of_minuscule.svg.png]

From wiki

"A humanist manuscript was intended to suggest its contents by its look," Martin Davies has noted: "old wine in new bottles, or the very latest vintage in stylish new dress".You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. 

This is how i see the manuscript, not only does it present up to date concepts which seem to correct older views, but it seems to A) refer to items shown in the past, and B) teach how to see things correctly in manuscripts from antiquity. It could be the same with these glyphs, usage in the vernacular, but pointing to their usage in antiquity, allowing one to take this knowledge (once recognized) and apply it to better read the old texts. 


RE: Choice of glyphs - -JKP- - 07-04-2019

1) Voynch "a" isn't necessarily a vowel. It could be a ligature (ci) or it could be a very slightly disguised number 7 (it was sometimes written like "a"). If you look at the first "a" on the first folio, it is stretched out and it's difficult to tell if it's "a" or a bench char. This MIGHT be because it's not an "a" at all, but was chosen to look like "a".

2) Also the assumption that "vowels" are vowels (which I've noticed is assumed in the majority of Voynich "solutions") is a very big assumption. If you swap all the glyphs that look like vowels with glyphs that look like consonants and vice-versa, the text has nearly the same properties as in its current form.

3) The glyph that looks like medieval 4 (l) was also used as an early medieval abbreviation symbol that meant the same thing as the later medieval "smoke" symbol.

4) The glyph that looks like c with a tail can be an embellished c, a c with abbreviation (e.g., ce, cer, etc.) or it can be an early medieval "and" symbol. The same is true of r with a tail, it can be embellished r, or r as abbreviation. C with tail was sometimes also used as an abbreviation for "con".

5) In Latin scripts, k is both a ligature and an abbreviation.

6) Maybe the minims are a sneaky way to represent the number one.

7) In some scripts 5 is represented by "o" and a dot is used for the letter "o", so it's even possible the "o" is a number.

8) In Latin and Greek scribal conventions, benched characters represent abbreviations and in Greek script, benched characters sometimes represent numbers.

When it comes down to it, the majority of VMS chars are similar to Latin (and some Greek) numbers and abbreviations/ligatures.



RE: Choice of glyphs - Linda - 07-04-2019

Agreed, they have had their various uses, and this is what i think might be pointed out, ie the author might have learned these things from going through old manuscripts and encountering them, and these would then become chosen as part of the alphabet for their own project, with whatever usage may have been applied.


RE: Choice of glyphs - -JKP- - 07-04-2019

(07-04-2019, 01:33 PM)Koen G Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view....
But why construct a glyph set that relies so heavily on numbers and abbreviation symbols?

If it's a cipher, that would not be unusual. Ciphers frequently include number forms. Greek letters are also very popular in medieval and post-medieval ciphers. And, since abbreviations were part of the "alphabet" at the time, a medieval cipher with abbreviation characters would not be out of place either.

I'm not saying it's a cipher, but the choice of shapes would not be out of line for a cipher.


RE: Choice of glyphs - Koen G - 07-04-2019

JKP: Regarding your (2), I mean that in everyday use, the sign "a" stood and still stands for a vowel. Of course that doesn't mean it represents a vowel in Voynichese, but the people who included it in the set knew that it's usually a vowel.

That's what I'm getting at: what did the glyph mean to them before they used it in the VM? Which characters did they select? As you say, it's clear that by and large they selected abbreviations, ligatures and numbers.

On ciphers including number forms and abbreviations: that's an interesting observation. Might we know of a cipher that combines number forms and abbreviations to a similar extent as the VM does? That would be quite the indication.


RE: Choice of glyphs - -JKP- - 07-04-2019

I was thinking about how a full set of numbers could be constructed from Voynich glyphs and it's not too hard to imagine one that's fairly rational.

Here's one idea...

i  s  iii  l   o   oi   a   d   y   k [font=Sans-serif]or[/font] [font=Eva][font=Eva] [font=Eva][font=Sans-serif]and[/font] [/font][/font][font=Eva]K [font=Eva][font=Sans-serif]or[/font] T[/font][/font] [font=Eva][font=Eva][font=Eva][font=Sans-serif]and[/font][/font][/font][/font] other gallows P F

[font=Sans-serif]or[/font]

i  ii  iii  l   o   [font=Eva]oi   a   d   y   k[/font] or t  and t  K [font=Eva][font=Sans-serif]or[/font] T[/font] [font=Eva][font=Eva][font=Eva][font=Eva][font=Sans-serif]and[/font][/font][/font][/font] other gallows P F[/font]

Five was sometimes written as "o" and seven was sometimes written almost like "a" (the old style 7 which is an upside-down vee with a slight hook on the bottom-left). In Greek, benched characters represent larger numbers (I've posted some examples on previous blogs), so those fit, as well.

Just an idea, but it shows it's not too difficult to devise a scheme that's almost all numbers that fits with medieval conventions.

I have actually tried to resolve this into numbers many times for one very simple but important reason... numbers are position dependent (15 is a different number from 51). And yes, c shapes might be minims as well. I've actually color-coded one of my transcripts this way.
[/font]



RE: Choice of glyphs - Koen G - 07-04-2019

(07-04-2019, 08:08 PM)-JKP- Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.I was thinking about how a full set of numbers could be constructed from Voynich glyphs and it's not too hard to imagine one that's fairly rational.

I was thinking something like this as well. We're not used to the medieval way of writing 4 and 5, but we do pick up on the "8" and "9". To the medieval scribe's eye, it must have looked even more number-heavy than it does to us.


RE: Choice of glyphs - -JKP- - 07-04-2019

(07-04-2019, 08:15 PM)Koen G Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
(07-04-2019, 08:08 PM)-JKP- Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.I was thinking about how a full set of numbers could be constructed from Voynich glyphs and it's not too hard to imagine one that's fairly rational.

I was thinking something like this as well. We're not used to the medieval way of writing 4 and 5, but we do pick up on the "8" and "9". To the medieval scribe's eye, it must have looked even more number-heavy than it does to us.

YES! Very much so.

The niggly part (the complication), is that there are quite a few different ways it could be resolved into numbers. What I posted above is just two of many possibilities. For example, r might be 5. They wrote five about six different ways. This one is cheating (you would have to mirror it, which is not necessary with the others), which is why I didn't include it with the first group, but it's another possibility.


RE: Choice of glyphs - Nikolai - 07-04-2019

Yes, some characters in the manuscript indicate numbers. It should be borne in mind, the number system is not decimal.