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+--- Thread: [split] f35v parallels "oak and ivy" (/thread-1869.html)
RE: [split] f35v parallels "oak and ivy" - Koen G - 05-08-2019
Hmm yes it's possible. If I'm correct about some plants, there are a few likely candidates.
RE: [split] f35v parallels "oak and ivy" - Koen G - 05-08-2019
What I actually think though, is that references were chosen which would allow the reader/viewer of the MS to embed the plant and its image in a wider network of knowledge. Therefore, I believe the mnemonic must relate to the plant in a different way than just the date.
For example I think one of the "candelabra" plants You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. is supposed to represent almond since in the Old Testament it is elaborately explained how the Menorah must resemble almond.
RE: [split] f35v parallels "oak and ivy" - Koen G - 05-08-2019
Some more examples of twining rope around the pole in Arma Christi (the previous one remains the best):
RE: [split] f35v parallels "oak and ivy" - -JKP- - 06-08-2019
I just looked at the VMS image again to see if the "oak" leaves could be interpreted as a crown of thorns, but it doesn't really work.
I've always wondered about those two handlike leaves halfway up, however. They seem so deliberate but I couldn't make out what they might represent.
Koen, I do like your suggestion for the roots as flails. That does seem possible.
RE: [split] f35v parallels "oak and ivy" - Koen G - 06-08-2019
I noticed that the flail parallel works particularly well when compared to this one MS (You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.), which also features the most convincing twining of the ropes around the column. This suggests that, if this mnemonic is indeed in place, it was taken from an image directly related to this one.
The description says the miniatures were copied from You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. , but this MS includes only the standard "scientific" content and does not add the somewhat out of place Arma Christi page at the end...
RE: [split] f35v parallels "oak and ivy" - -JKP- - 06-08-2019
(06-08-2019, 08:46 AM)Koen G Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.I noticed that the flail parallel works particularly well when compared to this one MS (You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.), which also features the most convincing twining of the ropes around the column. This suggests that, if this mnemonic is indeed in place, it was taken from an image directly related to this one.
The description says the miniatures were copied from You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. , but this MS includes only the standard "scientific" content and does not add the somewhat out of place Arma Christi page at the end...
Ironically, I've sampled both text and faces from this folio (in BNF fr 574) in the past, but did not sample the flagellation items (and it never occurred to me that there might be a flagellation connection in the VMS, so I've zoomed past hundreds of flagellation illuminations over the years without giving them a second thought except for occasionally hunting for "the thing").
So... the reason this manuscript caught my attention was not the flagellation items, but the duc de Berry ex lib (duc de Berry seems to come up frequently when I am searching for Voynich-related imagery) and also the added text just after that folio that includes this three-headed flower, which is a bit unusual (there were lots of curlicues in signatures in those days, but a more explicit flower motif was definitely less common). I also sampled the hellmouth image (I have a lot of hellmouths).
and the large drawing of the viola that follows it (I remember thinking to myself, someone connected with this region is interested in plants but the plant is odd, the stems are thick and cut as though it were a tree/shrub (trimming the stems is not something one does with viola) and the leaves are wrong, but the flowers are drawn like viola. It's almost like it's a hybrid plant... emblematic. The text above it is 14th or 15th century, so the text is not as early as the earlier part of the manuscript, but it's still within 15th century range.
RE: [split] f35v parallels "oak and ivy" - Linda - 06-08-2019
The four way loop cross looks similar to the detail on one of the nymph's heads on f80r. Does it have particular meaning?
RE: [split] f35v parallels "oak and ivy" - -JKP- - 06-08-2019
Here is the Arma Christi imagery in a tapestry (15c 3°) that is remarkable for its detail.
The helical twining occurs twice, once on each side, once as a rope, the other as a shawl. The suns and moons have faces and there are hundreds of plants (most of them recognizable):
Image courtesy of The Met, full image here:
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RE: [split] f35v parallels "oak and ivy" - Koen G - 06-08-2019
The rooster is also one of the Arma Christi by the way. I'm quickly posting from my phone so can't look up folio number, but there's one VM plant that could have a rooster root (not talking about the spread wings one).
RE: [split] f35v parallels "oak and ivy" - -JKP- - 06-08-2019
I've always wondered if the spread-wings one might be an angel. It also could be a raptor, but something about it reminds me of angels.