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+--- Thread: The Voynich Pipes (/thread-1161.html)
RE: The Voynich Pipes - Koen G - 26-11-2016
Thanks for noticing, Rene. It appears that Don had deleted this thread as a parting gift. I restored it, hope it is accessible now: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
He provides a nice color version of this image, but the link to these specific VM folios is not made, if I'm not mistaken.
If the "pipes" signify some kind of sighting tube, or whatever they do in this MS, it could tell us quite a bit about this folio.
RE: The Voynich Pipes - Helmut Winkler - 27-11-2016
I think it is Recta linea si serves luminu[m] in curru horas noctis nosse potes galli sine vocibus _ If you draw a straight line in the race of the lights, you can know the hours of the night without a cock crowing
RE: The Voynich Pipes - davidjackson - 27-11-2016
That makes sense, in light of ReneZ's comment that the image shows how to tell time You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view..
What would the author have understood by the phrase "in the race of the lights"?
RE: The Voynich Pipes - -JKP- - 27-11-2016
(27-11-2016, 09:54 AM)davidjackson Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.That makes sense, in light of ReneZ's comment that the image shows how to tell time You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view..
What would the author have understood by the phrase "in the race of the lights"?
Recta linea si serves luminu[m] in curru horas noctis nosse potes galli sine vocibus.
When I read this line, it lent itself so naturally to verse, I ended up translating it this way:
If you align the lights in the course of the night,
the hours you will know, without the cock's crow.
RE: The Voynich Pipes - Helmut Winkler - 27-11-2016
"in the race of the lights" is bad English for German "Der Lauf der Gestirne"; I hope someone knows a better English translation for currus luminum, I suspect star transit is the right word, but there are people better qualified to judge
RE: The Voynich Pipes - Koen G - 27-11-2016
You would be a good medieval person, JKP
Does anybody understand how this system worked in practice? I can't understand how you can see the time in the stars without using a table of months + orientations of constellations.
Helmut: something like "path"?
RE: The Voynich Pipes - -JKP- - 27-11-2016
(27-11-2016, 10:44 AM)Koen Gh. Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.You would be a good medieval person, JKP
Does anybody understand how this system worked in practice? I can't understand how you can see the time in the stars without using a table of months + orientations of constellations.
Helmut: something like "path"?
I think it may have been intended as "cursu" which translates very naturally to "course" (duration, direction/position of travel) in English.
RE: The Voynich Pipes - ReneZ - 27-11-2016
(27-11-2016, 10:44 AM)Koen Gh. Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.You would be a good medieval person, JKP
Does anybody understand how this system worked in practice? I can't understand how you can see the time in the stars without using a table of months + orientations of constellations.
Helmut: something like "path"?
Koen,
this method immediately tells you what is the 'sidereal time'.
To convert sidereal time to local time (for any given location) one only needs to know the day of the year.
The difference shifts by slightly less than 4 minutes per day.
It can easily be done without a sighting tube, You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. .
RE: The Voynich Pipes - Helmut Winkler - 27-11-2016
something like "path"?
Yes, something like that. currus in classical Latin is a wagon or cart, but a Medieval latinist would think of the verb currere/to run as well and invent a new meaning like " the running of the stars"
P.S. The Vat. lat. and the MGH edition following it give intuitu
RE: The Voynich Pipes - Koen G - 27-11-2016
Thanks, Rene, very clear article. So basically you imagine a line from Polaris through B Cassiopeia, read it like the arm on a 24-hour clock and then adjust 4 minutes for every day passed since March 21.
But then why did they need a big tube?
I can see how the VM diagrams could be something similar, where the star in the middle for example indicates the celestial pole or a standard reference star.