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+--- Thread: A random rant about the VMS (/thread-5247.html)
RE: A random rant about the VMS - R. Sale - 18-01-2026
Yes, it is a simplified structure. That's the point. The cosmic diagrams of BNF Fr. 565, Harley 334, and the interior part of the VMs illustration all share the same simplified, atypical, cosmic structure.
The pictorial representations of the Earth are not geographical. They are elemental. Wavy line patterns in the lower half represent water, while the upper half is divided between land and air. (Fire is omitted.) This is particularly clear in the first image of Post #20, where air is represented by nebuly lines. However, this image is not a *cosmic* diagram.
The VMs Earth is not pictorial; it is linguistic. The VMs stars are not golden asterisks; they are inked and polygonal. The VMs cosmic boundary is not the elaborated, scallop-shell pattern of BNF Fr. 565 nor the unembellished, plain line of Harley 334: it is a somewhat less than smooth version of a regular nebuly line, with 43 undulations (playing hide and seek) - structurally the same as the 43 undulations of BNF FR. 565. VMs is the same *cosmic structure* with a different appearance.
Both BNF and Harley were made in Paris between 1400 and 1450. Their structural similarity to the VMs seems clear. Additionally. the Berry Apocalypse [MS M. 133] has illustrations that consistently use nebuly lines as cosmic boundaries and it, along with BNF Fr. 565, was in the Duke of Berry's library before his death in Paris in 1416. It's a simple case of mix and match.
The wheel with eight curved spokes has only one historical source (AFAIK) and that is Shirakatsi's Eight Phases of the Moon, which, despite its origins (7th C. Armenia), is not that far out of touch as it might seem. The Genoese were in the Black Sea a century before the VMs C-14 dates. Diplomatic contacts with Europe only increased as Muslim forces threatened Byzantine Constantinople. Even the Burgundians had ships in the Black Sea during the C-14 era. And those contacts continued till the fall of Trebizond in the early 1460s.
If there is an alternative, let's see it! Otherwise, it is what it appears to be - a combination of two unrelated astronomical elements to form a unique, cosmic oxymoron and an indicator of what to expect in other VMs illustrations. The hangup seems to be that the "experts" failed to identify the historical parts.
RE: A random rant about the VMS - Jorge_Stolfi - 18-01-2026
(Yesterday, 03:23 PM)Stefan Wirtz_2 Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.Even funnier things happened on the way to the forum...:
Aha, thanks! So the three divisions are sea, land, and sky.
All the best, --stolfi
Too bad that on f68v3 the bottom part has a three-line text rather than a single word. But at least we know now that opCholdg means "land", and okodal means "pea soup with pappardelle".
All the best, --stolfi
RE: A random rant about the VMS - Jorge_Stolfi - 18-01-2026
(Yesterday, 03:23 PM)Stefan Wirtz_2 Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.Someone will bring up that Armenian circle with 8 arms upon this. I don't.
The Armenians (like the Georgians) were Christian, just not of the Church of Rome. So I suppose that there would be many Armenians all over Europe, and many people from all over Europe living and visiting Armenia, without History bothering to take note of it. No?
All the best, --stolfi
RE: A random rant about the VMS - Rafal - 18-01-2026
Quote:But at least we know now that opCholdg means "land", and okodal means "pea soup with pappardelle"
Supposed "land" and "air" words are hapaxes, they don't appear anywhere else.
And if they were in fact "land" and "air" then they really should.
One of many weird and annoying things about Voynichese is that it doesn't have any cribs.
Zero, zip, zilch, nada.
Not a single word where you could suspect its meaning and it would work in several places.
RE: A random rant about the VMS - Jorge_Stolfi - 18-01-2026
(Yesterday, 10:19 PM)Rafal Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.Supposed "land" and "air" words [opCholdg and okodal] are hapaxes, they don't appear anywhere else.
As such, together they don't. But opChol is fairly common, and dg does occur elsewhere.
And dg may have been dy: otchol dy occurs as a label on another Cosmo page, f67r2.32 (at 02:30, just outwards of the "planet").
And okodas occurs on that same sector, but just inward of the planet...
All the best,--stolfi.
RE: A random rant about the VMS - R. Sale - 18-01-2026
You don't need a host of Armenians relocating to Paris, books and ideas travel on their own. There was plenty of time for contact to occur. Just seeing the illustration is sufficient to pass the idea. Even the orientation is irrelevant, because it's different sides of the same thing. All the VMs person did was to write between the lines instead of avoiding that.
I don't make any claims about the language. However, the fact that there are words, rather than pictures, indicates that - if the other points of comparison are valid - this is potentially an intentional code shift on the part of the VMs artist, and it is another example from the VMs artist's basket of tricks - like "disguised" historical and literary references.
RE: A random rant about the VMS - ReneZ - 18-01-2026
(Yesterday, 09:42 PM)Jorge_Stolfi Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.Aha, thanks! So the three divisions are sea, land, and sky.
Plus paradise, in the upper left corner of 'land'.