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+--- Thread: I Can Read the Voynich MS (/thread-3048.html)
RE: I Can Read the Voynich MS - Rebekah - 17-01-2020
(17-01-2020, 12:28 AM)-JKP- Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.Linda Wrote:...[font=Verdana, Geneva, sans-serif]“north” צָפֹנָה (pronounced as[/font][font=Verdana, Geneva, sans-serif] tsafonah),[/font][font=Verdana, Geneva, sans-serif] “south” נֶגְבָּה [/font][font=Verdana, Geneva, sans-serif](negbah), [/font][font=Verdana, Geneva, sans-serif]“east” קֵדְמָה [/font][font=Verdana, Geneva, sans-serif](kedmah)[/font][font=Verdana, Geneva, sans-serif] and “west” יָמָּה [/font][font=Verdana, Geneva, sans-serif](yamah)...[/font]
If the cardinal points are on the diamond, I think it would more likely be qedem (qof dalet mem), teman, yam (yod mem), and tsaphon/tsafon (without the grammatical ending).
But I'm still not completely sure which diamond is meant. If it's the one I posted above (the one above the bottom-left rosette), then these don't match up well with the existing chars regardless of whether they are read left-to-right or right-to-left. Three of the "labels" begin or end with the same glyph and I'm not willing to accept an anagrammed Hebrew translation unless there is HUGE justification and proof for it because Hebrew is an abjad and anagramming could turn it into almost anything.
The Voynich MS is written ANCIENT Hebrew. The alphabet is located in the circle of Folio 57v. and again on Folio 66r. You have to read the word in ancient Hebrew. You show 2 pictures.......the bottom picture is the Compass Rose directional notations. The Bottom picture.
RE: I Can Read the Voynich MS - Rebekah - 17-01-2020
(17-01-2020, 12:14 AM)Linda Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.(16-01-2020, 08:35 PM)Rebekah Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.It's a sad story filled with the regrets of a young man named 'Poar' (pronounced "Far"; I believe). It is Poar's account of his crimes against many of the pregnant woman in his homeland and his subsequent banishment from his homeland for these crimes. This account tells of Poar's entire geneology, and about how Poar has brought great reproach on that lineage because of his crimes and his banishment that ultimately led to Poar's death, far away from his people.
Hi Rebekah, welcome to the forum. Quite a few people have stated they think Hebrew is involved so I am open to that possibility.
I am having a problem with the above since if it is Poar writing the story, how does he tell the story of his own death?
Or are you saying it is written by someone else as though it was a story written by Poar? What is the time and place of the story in your opinion?
Could you give us some examples of pages and their topics, ie does the entire manuscript tell the Poar story? If the story is about pregnant women i can see you getting this from quire 13 and the zodiac, but what about the other circles, plants and text-only pages? Can you read them also?
I have a problem with your saying you can read it, but not translate it, as well. Can you read it aloud? Or do you mean you get the gist of it from the pictures and the look of a word here and there?
Quote:But I do know for a fact that the words in the Green Diamond on the bottom left corner of the Map are in fact the Compass Rose directional notations for: North, South, East & West.
If it is the diamond noted above, how does that correlate with modern Hebrew? (I have no experience with Hebrew)
Hebrew translation: North = tzafon, South = darom, East = mizrakh, West = ma'arav.
Or does it have to do with forward, back, left and right? With forward being east? You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
Or maybe (morning) sun, desert, sea, mountains ( seems a bit like like fire air water earth?)
[font=Verdana, Geneva, sans-serif] “north” צָפֹנָה (pronounced as tsafonah), “south” נֶגְבָּה (negbah), “east” קֵדְמָה (kedmah) and “west” יָמָּה (yamah).
[/font]You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
These examples from a quick google search don't seem to match so i don't know which words you mean, can you clarify? I assume you mean Hebrew alphabet representations thereof. But as yet i see no correlations to voynichese. Can you be specific? There is voynichese font in the message tools but it is not working for me or i would put the four words i think you are talking about here to await the Hebrew equivalents.
Sorry for so many questions but i want to understand what you are saying. As has been mentioned, many people claim to read the manuscript, but the lack of ability to translate leaves many of us skeptical, so the more you can tell us the better we can understand you.
This is ANCIENT Hebrew that was LOST by us as a Human Family; so you have to take care when comparing the new to the old. The alphabet that the Voynich MS was written in is located in the circle on Folio 57v. and again on Folio 66r. It's the Alphabet and it's obvious.
RE: I Can Read the Voynich MS - -JKP- - 17-01-2020
Okay, bottom picture that I posted. The diamond-shape above the rosette.
Tell us which word in that diagram is west or north. We only need to know one of them and please write out phonetically what the word says in your translation system.
P.S. I am not comparing it to new Hebrew. I'm comparing it to Biblical Hebrew that is 2,000 years old. Just give us a transliteration for one of the compass points and tell us which one is north. And ancient Hebrew is not lost. There are readable scrolls.
RE: I Can Read the Voynich MS - Rebekah - 17-01-2020
(17-01-2020, 04:29 AM)-JKP- Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.Rebekah WHICH lower picture? The very small one in the lower left? (it is not diamond-shaped and it is not green).
Or do you mean the diamond-shape above the lower-left rosette?
Post your EXACT translation for these four compass points please and let use know which drawing you mean by "Compass Rose". You're not being at all clear. There are a lot of shapes on that folio.
this is the Compass Rose
RE: I Can Read the Voynich MS - Rebekah - 17-01-2020
(17-01-2020, 04:21 AM)-JKP- Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.Rebekah Wrote:That's great that that many people are interested in the Voynich MS. But check this out: on the Map page in the lower-left corner is what is essentially our Compass Rose with the directional notions; North, South, East & West. With this information alone, someone should be able to translate the Voynich MS into the language that it was written in....ancient perfect Hebrew; including all of it's vowels.
Would you please post a screensnap of this "Compass Rose" and your translation next to the Voynich glyphs so we know what you are talking about.
Ancient Hebrew didn't have vowels so you will have to indicate those too.
Here's a picture of the Compass Rose. And yes, ancient Hebrew always had vowels; the reason that the writings have no vowels is because the SCRIBES dropped them out of laziness, assuming that everyone in the future would know what they meant.
The alphabet that the Voynich MS was written in is on Folio 57v. and again on Folio 66 r. Check them out.
(17-01-2020, 12:02 AM)Koen G Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.Or if the T-O map is repurposed as something else and a compass is not redundant.
It might be something like the strip map you say though. The text alignment suggests that the map was rotated depending on which part you're looking at, so its a dynamic business.
This is the Compass Rose. The alphabet that the Voynich MS was written is listed in the circle on Folio 57v. and again on Folio 66r. Check it out.
RE: I Can Read the Voynich MS - -JKP- - 17-01-2020
You're stringing us along.
There are a lot of intelligent people on this forum. I doubt if they will appreciate that.
RE: I Can Read the Voynich MS - Rebekah - 17-01-2020
(17-01-2020, 05:15 AM)-JKP- Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.You're stringing us along.
There are a lot of intelligent people on this forum. I doubt if they will appreciate that.
No I am not stringing you along....I really can read the VMS and so can you. The alphabet is located in the circle on Folio 57v. and again on Folio 66r. Check it out. It is the ancient Hebrew dialect.
RE: I Can Read the Voynich MS - -JKP- - 17-01-2020
I don't need to "check it out". I am very familiar with those folios. I can practically see them in my head.
They do not have the VMS glyphs in the same order. In fact, on 66r, they repeat, so how can they both be an "alphabet"?
RE: I Can Read the Voynich MS - Rebekah - 17-01-2020
(17-01-2020, 04:21 AM)-JKP- Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.Rebekah Wrote:That's great that that many people are interested in the Voynich MS. But check this out: on the Map page in the lower-left corner is what is essentially our Compass Rose with the directional notions; North, South, East & West. With this information alone, someone should be able to translate the Voynich MS into the language that it was written in....ancient perfect Hebrew; including all of it's vowels.
Would you please post a screensnap of this "Compass Rose" and your translation next to the Voynich glyphs so we know what you are talking about.
Ancient Hebrew didn't have vowels so you will have to indicate those too.
Compass Rose screenshot.
(16-01-2020, 10:36 PM)R. Sale Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.Seriously? That's fabulous!
How is Poar's name written in the Voynich Manuscript?
RE: I Can Read the Voynich MS - Linda - 17-01-2020
(17-01-2020, 04:31 AM)Rebekah Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.(16-01-2020, 10:36 PM)R. Sale Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.Seriously? That's fabulous!
How is Poar's name written in the Voynich Manuscript?
It is in his Family Geneology listed in Folio 68v. first circle. In the middle are 2 words: "atta-dae"; meaning father-?, and "aphe-caedd"; meaning mother-?...Poar is listed as the first name under the words, father and mother; along with his brother's and sisters.
Poar's first name (and last name) are also written under his picture in the circle on Folio 73v.
I could tell you everything but to tired right now. But message me with any other questions you may have and I will certainly answer them if I am able.
Ok Rebekah, i can see Poar in You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. 3. Clear as day. I can even see the father and mother names you describe. I trust someone knowledgeable in Hebrew will confirm these words mean as you define them. These seem like the standard alphabet we use in English though, not Hebrew.
What are the other names? Can you write them out?
You lose me with the archer being Poar. His full name is written under his picture? There is some upside down writing that does not resember Poar. Is that what you mean?