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+--- Thread: No text, but a visual code (/thread-2384.html)
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RE: No text, but a visual code - ololololo - 23-08-2026
(19-08-2026, 04:32 AM)Radim Dobeš Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.These are conventions.(18-08-2026, 02:03 PM)Koen G Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.(18-08-2026, 12:25 PM)Radim Dobeš Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.I agree with you that the folding folio with rosettes is a cosmological model of the universe. Does everyone agree?
The answer to the question "[something about the Voynich Manuscript], does everyone agree?" is always "no".
If you're lucky, you'll get a "yes" on "does anyone agree?"
However, this also applies to the official classification of VMS into Herbal (Botanical)—why is it called that?—and Balneological (Biological)—why use this name when there is no generally accepted definition? Why "Pharmaceutical"—who agreed on that? And I certainly don't understand the category "Recipes"—is that generally accepted, too? And for what reason?
In Botany, we see drawings of plants, so we call this part Botany. We don’t know whether these are actually plants or not.
RE: No text, but a visual code - ololololo - 23-08-2026
(22-08-2026, 06:24 PM)Antonio García Jiménez Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.This is common astrological thought in the Middle Ages.Prove it. In which manuscripts do you see stars in the form of tubes?
As I’ve noticed, you present almost all of your interpretations as an indisputable truth — as if, in the Middle Ages, everything had to be exactly as you say. I don’t know of a single manuscript where the blue colour in plants (as you said) signified a connection with the cosmos. Until such manuscripts exist, we can’t say that this is some kind of universal tradition.
RE: No text, but a visual code - Radim Dobeš - 23-08-2026
(23-08-2026, 02:27 PM)ololololo Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.(22-08-2026, 06:24 PM)Antonio García Jiménez Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.This is common astrological thought in the Middle Ages.Prove it. In which manuscripts do you see stars in the form of tubes?
As I’ve noticed, you present almost all of your interpretations as an indisputable truth — as if, in the Middle Ages, everything had to be exactly as you say. I don’t know of a single manuscript where the blue colour in plants (as you said) signified a connection with the cosmos. Until such manuscripts exist, we can’t say that this is some kind of universal tradition.
maybe here are some helpfull examples for colour and meaning
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
RE: No text, but a visual code - ololololo - 23-08-2026
(23-08-2026, 02:54 PM)Radim Dobeš Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.Oh, it’s not loading for me(23-08-2026, 02:27 PM)ololololo Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.(22-08-2026, 06:24 PM)Antonio García Jiménez Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.This is common astrological thought in the Middle Ages.Prove it. In which manuscripts do you see stars in the form of tubes?
As I’ve noticed, you present almost all of your interpretations as an indisputable truth — as if, in the Middle Ages, everything had to be exactly as you say. I don’t know of a single manuscript where the blue colour in plants (as you said) signified a connection with the cosmos. Until such manuscripts exist, we can’t say that this is some kind of universal tradition.
maybe here are some helpfull examples for colour and meaning
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
. Could you please tell me what exactly is there?
RE: No text, but a visual code - Jorge_Stolfi - 23-08-2026
(19-08-2026, 04:32 AM)Radim Dobeš Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.And I certainly don't understand the category "Recipes"—is that generally accepted, too? And for what reason?Another name sometimes used for that section is "Starred Paragraphs"n, which does not require any interpretation.
But that name is long and inconvenient. The parags could be anything, but, given that the rest of the book seemed to be about medicine (the Herbal was obviously a herbal, and the Pharma section has those jars in the margin), recipes seemed to be a good guess. There are many examples of manuscripts from that time with lists of short recipes for medicines or foodstuffs. (Culpeper's herbal too has two main sections: a list of medicinal plants, with history, properties, etc, and a list of recipes of remedies that one can make from those plants.) Hence the conventional name "Recipes".
(It turns out that the correct name for that section is "Remedies", that is, medicinal substances -- what pharmacists of the time called "simples". But who cares about the truth?)
All the best, --stolfi
RE: No text, but a visual code - Linda - 23-08-2026
(23-08-2026, 02:58 PM)ololololo Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.(23-08-2026, 02:54 PM)Radim Dobeš Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.maybe here are some helpfull examples for colour and meaningOh, it’s not loading for me
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It is a page called Colour and Meaning. It goes on to talk about green crosses, vermillion faces and hands of angels, blue to contrast Jesus's yellow clothes and red angel wings, gold or red rays to signify divine energy from heaven to earth, to name a few. Unless I am missing something, nothing seems to correlate directly with anything particular insofar as Antonio's identifications.
RE: No text, but a visual code - Radim Dobeš - 23-08-2026
(23-08-2026, 04:37 PM)Jorge_Stolfi Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.Thank you for the explanation, but this established dogma will soon need to be re-evaluated as well.(19-08-2026, 04:32 AM)Radim Dobeš Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.And I certainly don't understand the category "Recipes"—is that generally accepted, too? And for what reason?Another name sometimes used for that section is "Starred Paragraphs"n, which does not require any interpretation.
But that name is long and inconvenient. The parags could be anything, but, given that the rest of the book seemed to be about medicine (the Herbal was obviously a herbal, and the Pharma section has those jars in the margin), recipes seemed to be a good guess. There are many examples of manuscripts from that time with lists of short recipes for medicines or foodstuffs. (Culpeper's herbal too has two main sections: a list of medicinal plants, with history, properties, etc, and a list of recipes of remedies that one can make from those plants.) Hence the conventional name "Recipes".
(It turns out that the correct name for that section is "Remedies", that is, medicinal substances -- what pharmacists of the time called "simples". But who cares about the truth?)
All the best, --stolfi
RE: No text, but a visual code - Radim Dobeš - 23-08-2026
(23-08-2026, 05:13 PM)Linda Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.(23-08-2026, 02:58 PM)ololololo Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.[quote="Radim Dobeš" pid='90106' dateline='1787493293']Oh, it’s not loading for me
maybe here are some helpfull examples for colour and meaning
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
It is a page called Colour and Meaning. It goes on to talk about green crosses, vermillion faces and hands of angels, blue to contrast Jesus's yellow clothes and red angel wings, gold or red rays to signify divine energy from heaven to earth, to name a few. Unless I am missing something, nothing seems to correlate directly with anything particular insofar as Antonio's identifications.
Blue, linked to the divine, could also stand for the unusual and potentially dangerous.
RE: No text, but a visual code - Antonio García Jiménez - 23-08-2026
Linda, you're right. There comes a point where I get lost in the whole tangle of texts.
Yesterday, I posted something describing and explaining the central rosette—the sphere of the fixed stars. You replied that you agreed with me until I mentioned the common medieval belief that the healing properties of herbs came from the stars. But what I am saying is not some strange, esoteric doctrine; it is the doctrine of Saint Albert the Great, who, in De vegetabilibus (Book V), explains the natural forces acting upon plants as well as occult forces, such as the virtus caelestis. It is this latter force—the one provided by the stars—that leaves a cosmic imprint on every herb, along with its healing virtue.
Healing power comes from God through the celestial spheres. No one in the Middle Ages thought about chemical processes or photosynthesis. And this entire—perfectly orthodox—concept is what, in my opinion, is conveyed in the central sphere of the Rosettes, with those sumptuous vessels that seem to gather that virtus caelestis of which Saint Albert the Great speaks.
ololololo, I never said that nonsense about stars shaped like tubes. What I said is that the authors of the Voynich use the tubes to channel the influence of the stars.
I do not present my interpretations as indisputable truth. What I do is formulate probable hypotheses, using the intelligence we all possess to draw inferences based on what we know. I have always maintained that one does not need to see a manuscript like the Voynich with clear text to understand the message conveyed by its images.
RE: No text, but a visual code - ololololo - 23-08-2026
(23-08-2026, 06:01 PM)Antonio García Jiménez Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.ololololo, I never said that nonsense about stars shaped like tubes. What I said is that the authors of the Voynich use the tubes to channel the influence of the stars.Sorry, I generalized. However, this sounds even more complicated and “vague.”