(02-06-2026, 11:12 AM)ololololo Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.[..]
However, if we try to substitute Latin letters somehow, we get nothing, because this is not a simple substitution, because it's not a simple substitution, but something based on it.
Well then try something different.
Voynichese is not Latin, it is not German.
Latin letters are a waste of time, but there is still no reason why this is not a „simple substitution“.
You are from Russia, should have some more ideas…
(02-06-2026, 11:42 AM)Stefan Wirtz_2 Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. (02-06-2026, 11:12 AM)ololololo Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.[..]
However, if we try to substitute Latin letters somehow, we get nothing, because this is not a simple substitution, because it's not a simple substitution, but something based on it.
Well then try something different.
Voynichese is not Latin, it is not German.
Latin letters are a waste of time, but there is still no reason why this is not a „simple substitution“.
You are from Russia, should have some more ideas…
It will be interesting to hear your opinion, What is Voynich cipher like?? Let's just say that the Proto-Roman language and the code of the Cathars aren't accepted
.
I also didn't know that living in Russia gives you more creativity. Although maybe you know it better...
(02-06-2026, 12:03 PM)ololololo Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.[..]
I also didn't know that living in Russia gives you more creativity. [..]
At least it gives you some more alphabet(s).
(02-06-2026, 11:07 AM)ololololo Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.My question is, is there a possibility that the cipher of the manuscript is based on numbers (in particular, Roman ones)?
Yes, it is possible, i see no reason why voynichese could not be based on numbers.
The resemblance of EVA-'iiin' and family to the Roman Numerals II, III, IIV, etc, have oft been remarked upon but idk of any deep attempts to link the two.
My light play with the idea
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Roman numerals to Voynicheesy
post by ReneZ about his mod2 cipher system but the links in that post are dead.
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A short post by Elmar Vogt about Cistercian numerals
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J.K.Petersens blog "Voynich portal" has a couple of posts about the similarites between voynichese and Greek and Roman numerals.
/a-helping-hand/ and /running-the-numbers/
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Complete aside but found this wonderful article from New Scientist in the archives from 2005..https://www.voynich.net/Arch/2005/04/msg00050.html
(02-06-2026, 03:26 PM)RobGea Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. (02-06-2026, 11:07 AM)ololololo Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.My question is, is there a possibility that the cipher of the manuscript is based on numbers (in particular, Roman ones)?
Yes, it is possible, i see no reason why voynichese could not be based on numbers.
The resemblance of EVA-'iiin' and family to the Roman Numerals II, III, IIV, etc, have oft been remarked upon but idk of any deep attempts to link the two.
My light play with the idea
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
Roman numerals to Voynicheesy
post by ReneZ about his mod2 cipher system but the links in that post are dead.
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
A short post by Elmar Vogt about Cistercian numerals
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.
J.K.Petersens blog "Voynich portal" has a couple of posts about the similarites between voynichese and Greek and Roman numerals.
/a-helping-hand/ and /running-the-numbers/
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Thank you very much! Well, I've looked at all the links, and it seems to me that my approach will be closer to yours. I once also tried to match the letters of the manuscript with Roman numerals, but in the end I fell into empty speculation. Of these, I managed to calculate e = 10, a = 5 and ch = 50, the rest I equated to Arabic, and as always, I did not find a place for the gallows. But I don't consider the failures of a layman to be an argument against, and i'm sure that the encryption with numbers is quite possible for the 15th century.
(02-06-2026, 11:42 AM)Stefan Wirtz_2 Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.but there is still no reason why this is not a „simple substitution“
The letter ordering makes it extremely unlikely to be simple substitution for any language that does not have fairly rigid letter ordering. It is possible, of course, that someone will provide a representation of a language ameniable to Voynichese's peculiar ordering, but thus far nothing
(02-06-2026, 07:02 PM)rikforto Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. (02-06-2026, 11:42 AM)Stefan Wirtz_2 Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.but there is still no reason why this is not a „simple substitution“
The letter ordering makes it extremely unlikely to be simple substitution for any language that does not have fairly rigid letter ordering. It is possible, of course, that someone will provide a representation of a language ameniable to Voynichese's peculiar ordering, but thus far nothing
It is worth adding that versions of some exotic language are usually either too speculative or rather contradictory.
(02-06-2026, 11:07 AM)ololololo Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.My question is, is there a possibility that the cipher of the manuscript is based on numbers (in particular, Roman ones)?
Please check the second half of You are not allowed to view links.
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The structure of the Voynichese "words" and their length distribution of the lengths do suggest that the text is a codebook cypher, with numbers written in a Roman-like notation.
But I don't put much probability in that idea, because such ciphers are too hard to write and read.
All the best, --stolfi
(02-06-2026, 09:10 PM)Jorge_Stolfi Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view. (02-06-2026, 11:07 AM)ololololo Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.My question is, is there a possibility that the cipher of the manuscript is based on numbers (in particular, Roman ones)?
Please check the second half of You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view..
The structure of the Voynichese "words" and their length distribution of the lengths do suggest that the text is a codebook cypher, with numbers written in a Roman-like notation.
But I don't put much probability in that idea, because such ciphers are too hard to write and read.
All the best, --stolfi
Yes, it's really difficult, but considering that the book was written by at least 3 people (these are only scribes, the whole "team" could be more), it seems possible. And maybe the encryption algorithm was simpler than we think.