There are a few examples of connected dots/circles in the VM, one on the Rosettes foldout and four on f67v. We don't know if the examples on both folios represent the same thing.
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I am wondering which parallels for these have been found. If I recall correctly, there are two main categories: magical writing and celestial bodies.
The examples of magical writing I know of are in Hebrew manuscripts or later traditions based on them, and they postdate the VM. Does anyone know of pre-1450 examples?
An alternative is constellations. I remember we discussed this on the forum once, but I am unable to find it. It is similar to this MS, though it uses asterisk-style stars instead of circles.
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I labelled the constellations. It seems that especially Taurus and Capricorn are similar to the thing on the Rosettes foldout, but I don't know if this would be generally recognized.
Hi Koen,
I think it is worth mentioning that only one of the Voynich diagrams includes dots, the others have larger circles with faces. It would be interesting to also find parallels for the diagrams with faces. Of course, one can speculate that the faces represent stars, but the personification of individual stars (planets aside) is not so common. I think that this kind of personification possibly happened in the early alchemical work
Gratheus filius Philosophi mentioned You are not allowed to view links.
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You are not allowed to view links.
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Login to view. (England, 1150 ca) has constellation diagrams with connected dots.
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Matthias posted some You are not allowed to view links.
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Login to view. which, as you say, are slightly later than the VMS. In my opinion, the seals might be derived from constellation diagrams, but I am again speculating.
Thanks, Marco! Yes, you are right, I forgot to stress how different they are. If they are the same kind of thing, the three dots on the Rosettes foldout are probably a simple form of the ones with faces, but they may be something completely different as well.
The diagram you show is very interesting because it shows right away that there is some consistency between manuscripts. Here, Capricorn and Taurus are also three dots in a V.
I agree that fixed stars are unlikely to get a face, so if they represent celestial bodies, they are likely planets. (But why would they connect planets like constellations?)
Regarding magical writing/sigils, Cary and I have been looking for examples but we only found some Jewish ones. The sigils are used like a substitution alphabet to write holy names. The problem of dating remains though, since we didn't find any pre-1450 example.
The faces are an attempt at artistic humor, all those odd little creatures than inhabit the margins of some manuscripts, along with a strong tendency to give everything a persona, to put faces on the sun and moon, etc. Roger Bacon's depiction of happy little atoms? What's with the pointy hat?
In the VMs, does the first pattern have a meaning or a function? Does it constitute a clue to the VMs solution? By its orientation, open to the right, it is a match to Capricorn. And if we wish to consult the image of VMs Capricorn? OH! Gosh, somebody apparently took that page, long ago. Remember the excised pages. It's a clue to a page that no longer exists <apparently>. What use is that? The VMs is what's left, after the 'good' parts were removed. Is there enough left to effect a workable reconstruction? That remains to be seen.
If it is Capricorn, what could it mean? My knowledge of astronomy has gotten rusty. Winter solstice?
I was simply suggesting that this might imply that information relevant to VMs interpretation would be found on the Capricorn page. Whether or not that ties in with Capricorn's astrology or astronomy is another aspect.
If the symbol itself were to stand for something, rather than being a reference, that would have to make sense on the same page as the symbol was represented, not on a different page.
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attachment=6241]Sometimes something else is meant.
For example, in the connections of the spheres it says:
Humour, Colera, Melanchonie....and not readable.
(23-02-2022, 08:03 AM)Aga Tentakulus Wrote: You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login to view.Sometimes something else is meant.
For example, in the connections of the spheres it says:
Humour, Colera, Melanchonie....and not readable.
Possibly relates to "Quattuor humores ": sanguis (Aer), cholera (ignis), melancholia (terra), phlegma(aqua).
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You could be right about that.
The English wiki seems a bit simple with explanations. So I recommend the German one and then translate the whole page.
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That's a standard tetradic (four-part) diagram.The circles with faces show some similarities with this, especially the ones on the T-O diagram and the ones that form a cross. I think there are some arguments against the interpretation as tetradic diagrams though.
* Variation in number and arrangement: triangle (3), U-shape (4), L-shape (4), cross-shape (4).
* Labels: the whole is labelled, not the individual circles. In a tetradic diagram, the focus of the labels is on the individual parts, i.e. "this is water, it is wet and cold".
* In the same vein, the cross looks most like a tetradic diagram but its faces are pretty similar. This suggests again that the focus is on the shape of the arrangement rather than the individual parts.
This is not entirely conclusive since some of the faces (like the one with the pointy hat) are unique. However, their overall similarity and especially the fact that only the group is labelled seems to suggest that especially the arrangement of the cluster is important.